Anyone here collect muscle cars?

[Viper99]

Seems to me that late 1960's and early 1970's muscle cars are appreciating at a rate of 20-30% a year. It would appear to be a sound investment if you do your homework and get the right car. Also, a nice investment that can be enjoyed as it's appreciating. I bought a 1979 Special Edition Trans Am with 10,000 original miles in 1996 for $9600 and sold it in 2000 when I bought my Viper for $20,000.

[plumcrazy]

lots of money to be made on these old cars...

especially mopars...

[Venom 1000TT]

Re: Anyone here collect muscle cars?

Most junkyards do!!LMAO

[nofearracer]

Ive got a few of them as you can see by the list. I had a 69 charger rt that I bought 3 yrs ago , and I just sold it for 7000 more than I paid for it and never put a cent in it other than tires. At this point in time there a better investment than a viper, but in 30 yrs we can sell the vipers a barrett-jackson and make a killing on them.

[Mopar426]

We have a couple then again we do have a classic car restoration shop.

Key is finding the right car, but it's still a win/win situation. Not many investments allow you to wnjoy the investment. make money, and certain that you'll NEVER lose money. True the car might only appreciate 1-2% for that year, it will NEVER decrease in value since they are no longer in production/molds are broken. Mopars are increasing radpidly, but SOON they will hit their celing.

[Matt M, PA]

In the past I have had 2 Superbirds, a '69 Road Runner convertible, and currently a '72 Plymouth Scamp that's a family heirloom.

While the values of musclecars are strong now...it's not going to last forever. If you look at the next generation coming, they are not interested (mostly) in the old American iron. It's all import-compact BS these days...and this is why musclecar values will drop. Just like cars of the from the teens to the 50's already have. Obviously, there are standouts like Duesenbergs and the like that will always command top dollar.

I have been showing national winning cars since 1989, and have seen the shows change drastically. It used to be that the "real" classics (20s, 30s, 40s) used to be very popular at the shows, with Model As for example, being present by the dozen. Now, the oldest car at a local show is a late '50s machine. Those that remember the cars of this vintage are either too old to care or have passed on. The same thing will happen to musclecars.

I still believe that you should never buy a car as an investment. Buy a car you REALLY like, just because you like it. If in the end, it makes you some money...that's a bonus. I restored my '72 because the car and I grew up togther and it means something personal to me.

[Shelby3]

In the past I have had 2 Superbirds, a '69 Road Runner convertible, and currently a '72 Plymouth Scamp that's a family heirloom.

While the values of musclecars are strong now...it's not going to last forever. If you look at the next generation coming, they are not interested (mostly) in the old American iron. It's all import-compact BS these days...and this is why musclecar values will drop. Just like cars of the from the teens to the 50's already have. Obviously, there are standouts like Duesenbergs and the like that will always command top dollar.

I have been showing national winning cars since 1989, and have seen the shows change drastically. It used to be that the "real" classics (20s, 30s, 40s) used to be very popular at the shows, with Model As for example, being present by the dozen. Now, the oldest car at a local show is a late '50s machine. Those that remember the cars of this vintage are either too old to care or have passed on. The same thing will happen to musclecars.

I still believe that you should never buy a car as an investment. Buy a car you REALLY like, just because you like it. If in the end, it makes you some money...that's a bonus. I restored my '72 because the car and I grew up togther and it means something personal to me.

This is a very accurate explanation.

[SCLSSRT10]

I have a 1974 Pontiac Trans Am with a SD455 4 speed. This is one of 212 and was in the orginial CannonBall in 1975. It has been pictured on the covers of Car & Driver and High Performance Pontiac. I am currently very torn about selling this car but I have been told it could be worth six figures now. I am also the fourth and eight owners(my brother was the third). I have all documentation to prove this car is what it is, but I am not sure if I will regret selling it. The car is almost mint, I drove it in the 1999 CannonBall classic from New York to California. A hell of a thing to do to a 100 point national show winner (it still does very well at the Trans Am Nationals and POCI Nationals shows 10 years after a frame off restoration) but it was worth the fun and publicity. Should I sell it or keep it?

[Viper99]

I have a 1974 Pontiac Trans Am with a SD455 4 speed. This is one of 212 and was in the orginial CannonBall in 1975. It has been pictured on the covers of Car & Driver and High Performance Pontiac. I am currently very torn about selling this car but I have been told it could be worth six figures now. I am also the fourth and eight owners(my brother was the third). I have all documentation to prove this car is what it is, but I am not sure if I will regret selling it. The car is almost mint, I drove it in the 1999 CannonBall classic from New York to California. A hell of a thing to do to a 100 point national show winner (it still does very well at the Trans Am Nationals and POCI Nationals shows 10 years after a frame off restoration) but it was worth the fun and publicity. Should I sell it or keep it?

Funny. My search for an early 70's Trans Am prompted me to post this question. I have always had an emotional attachment to the Trans Am having owned one a '79 as a teenager and later buying another 1979 SE Trans Am which I sold to get my Viper.
Unless you are forced to sell the car I would absolutely keep it. After 1974 the 455 Super Duty disappeared forever, and shortly after so did the muscle car era.
Just think of the 212 SD's made in 1974, How many survived....Not many I'd guess.
That is a great car with a great provenance (Is it Cameo White, Buccaneer Red, Brewster Green, or Admiralty Blue)?
If you get a chance, send me some pics!
Definitely keep it. That car is one that defines Detroit muscle.

[Lawrenzo]

Here's one to check out

http://www.boydshop.com/70transam/index.htm

[hemibeep]

Time out! If Muscle cars are just a fad that will be forgotten such as the model A's and 40's/50's, then why are all of the manufactures trying to "drum-up" images of these? ? a.k.a new charger? a.k.a. new G.T.O.(austrailian malibu) a.k.a. new mustang?.


I don't think that these 60's 70's muscle cars are going by the wayside in a few years. The manufactures are going back to these old styles to revive some of the images. Perhaps it is just a generation thing, but these new cars are causing interest in the old muscle cars. I am defending muscle cars because, like the Viper, they were purpose built and not just another of 1.8 million cars made every year. They were limited, and then you have to factor in destroyed/rusted and the demand should be consistant.


One could argue that imports is just a fad. No, I am not crazy. 10 years ago it was all about lowrider trucks, what happened to them?
Just food for thought.

Some day the Vipers will do well in Barett Jackson, after all these are also limited production and many have already been cracked up (mine included) The Viper has plain and simply created it own legacy as one of the greatest cars in American history.

[rcdice]

Great topic! Matt Morris above is right on. What's driving the value of muscle cars now? What's driving the nostalgic new cars coming out of Detroit today? Very easy, two words, Baby Boomers.

There are a lot of guys out there today that are give or take, 50 years old. Kids are out of the house and they have extra $$$ to play with. These guys were 10-15 years old in the mid 60's/early 70's and now have the chance to buy the car of their youthful dreams. That's what's driving the market. I think the "interest" in muscle cars will be with us for some time. But, eventually it will die down in a big way. When baby boomers start "down sizing" in mass, watch out below for many collectible cars. Many will have had there fun, relived their youth one last time and will be ready for that nice simple three bedroom condo with very little garage space.

Lastly, IMO, there will always be a market for very special, limited production, pristine classics. Just know that markets, all markets, shift and change overtime. Cars are no different.

[goldfish]

Just to add a few of my own observations...
It doesn't seem like you can go wrong with investing in classic 70's E-body Mopar muscle right now. Yes, it does cost a premium. I've owned 2 440-6bbl SHAKER 4-speed #s matching 'Cudas in the last four years. I've traded up over time and made a "few" dollars in the process. I didn't buy these cars as an investment, but instead because I loved them growing up (now in my mid-40's) and I absolutely have enjoyed driving them on weekends. I think the rarer Mopar muscle cars will always be a great investment. A 70 - 71 'cuda or challenger will always have a buyer, especially in a 4-speed and/or multiple carbs. I think the same will be true for a 340 duster or demon. The key to selling these cars quickly and at a profit is having a numbers matching car with a buildsheet (or verifiable window sticker). It's also worth spending the extra $$ to have somebody like Galen Govier authenticate the car. Also, a 4-speed is more desireable than an automatic and multiple carbs are always more desireable than a single 4 bbl.
I really do think, however, that 20 years down the road that the some of the most desireable mopars will be the Gen 2 Vipers. I think that the "stock" ACRs will be hotter than the "stock" GTSs, but both will be high demand cars (kind of like the difference in a 440-4 and 440-6 today). It's amazing how rare ANY Viper is. These are the cars that kids today look at in awe and dream about owning some day.
Finally, the Z06 Vettes are really cool cars and they are an incredible bang for the buck, but they just made so many compared to Vipers. Just me $0.02.

[94yellow]

I just sold a 67 shelby Gt500, I bought in 1988 and tripled the money I had in it. It is now living in England.

[46hemi]

I agree with Goldfish.

The E-bodies are doing great now and I do think they will cool off a bit but they will always have a special collectibility factor.

The difference with the Vipers and the E bodies are that unlike many vipers the old cars were driven and driven hard. That is why so few remain intact today. I see so many older vipers with low mileage so I think there will always be a fairly good supply of them. The 3k mile "survivor" will not have the same impact in the viper community in 30 years (IMHO).

Having said that I do feel the original ACR's will be worth some good money in the future. I think the total production of ACR's in the 4 years they were made is just north of 800. As a comparison between 70-71 ther were approximately 760 Hemi Cuda's and 1990 6-Packs. These are only Cuda numbers not all of the Hemi production across the different models.