N/A Cam setup??

[Indiana]

I have had cammed Lsx cars but I have never cammed a Viper. Seems like most just force the V10. I would like to stay NA and would like to see what options are out. Also, Do the head flow enough to just do a cam or do you have to do head work.

Gains with headers and exhaust???????

[1BADGTS]

You have a pm

[Green Viper]

I had Lingenfelter heads and custom camshaft installed on my GTS, the results were beyond even my high expectations. Let me know if you need their contact info.

James

[Indiana]

Thanks, I dont have a set date yet...

[0209 CLK]

I'd like to know this too...

[plumcrazy]

call greg good for a cam and head setup.

713-290-1103 tell him i sent ya

[2001 GTS]

Originally Posted by plumcrazy

call greg good for a cam and head setup.

713-290-1103 tell him i sent ya

Ditto...but tell him I sent you

[TexasPettey]

I'd like to see some of the aftermarket CAM specs relative to the 708 to understand what the impact on the power band would look like.

Also, what valve lift is the max that can be safely run?

[SquadX]

what plum and GTS2001 said, talk with Greg Good. I have a cam he did getting installed now. Also unless your doing it yourself, the cost to do just the cam is not worth it. i think you pick up 5-7 rwhp. So, like Chuck, J. Dell, know tricks to pulling the cam out with out removing the engine but I am sure most dealers and techs who work on vipers will pull the engine.

Also you have to replace the gaskets. I would wait and just do the heads along with the Cam. With GG heads/Cam package, i am sure you will gain around 75rwhp or more but along with the heads, you need to get the intake ported as well to get the full benefit and some say bigger TB but i think that is still up for debate. Plus with heads you should do RR, and springs are almost a must with a bigger cam and probably should upgrade push rods. I would call GG and get his advice or a quick schooling. I am doing this now: Cam/Heads, RR, springs, pushrods, rebuilt engine, etc.

Also expect to pay between 13-2k in labor for Cam/heads excluding gaskets which could add another 6-700.

[SquadX]

Also, If you going to pay for a CAM swap, I would avoid the 708. There are better cams out there for a few hundred more. if your paying for the labor, another 2-300 for a better cam wont hurt cause thats not something you want to do twice. Also depending on how much power you plan on running (ex. ported stryker heads will put you well over 600hp) you might want to consider a piston swap.

Also a SCT flash or Vec would help.

[SquadX]

to answer your other question, I would told that besides the sound, headers/exhaust are a poor cost per hp gain and that the stock headers (exhaust manifold) flowed pretty well.

Of course with head work/cam, etc, which depend alot on how things flow, you would probably see a nice increase in power with headers, exhaust but still not worth the money to me unless you pick up a used pair.

SCT flash will net you a solid 20-24rwhp for $650 and the VEC I assume a couple HP's more

[SquadX]

Go to Chuck Tator for gaskets, best prices around.

[fe4snake]

Talk to Gregg Good he will set you up with right stuff and he is the most honest person you are going to get.

Definetly you will need the following for serious power gains:
1. P&P Heads
2. Match Port Intake
3. Ported Stock TB's
4. Roller Rockers
5. Push Rods
6. Non-Bleed Lifters
7. Cam (Comp Cam) Custom Grind to your needs
8. ARP Head Studs
9. New Gaskets
10. Tunning

Cost around 10k if you do the install yourself and somebody else does the tunning.

My car dynoed @ 571 rwhp & 545 rwtq on a 94 deg. temp.

[1BADGTS]

I was never much of a dyno numbers guy INSTEAD give me a quarter mile trap speed (on stock tires )as a TRUE power indicator.Plain and simple (stock tires )if your Nat Asperated Gen 2 (worked motor )is not trapping approx 131 mph plus something is wrong.Many times over the years i saw guys producing dyno sheets that read 600 RWHP and their cars were trapping 3-4 mph less than my car on the same day(the most i ever made was 570 rwhp )

[rcdice]

Do any of the known tuners have a head/cam package that's been tested and proven to work? It seems like every time one of these threads gets started there are a bunch of ideas thrown out there but always with a "try this" approach.

I know for a fact that there are guys out there (like me) who would be willing to write a check to get the work done but DON'T want to be a guinea pig for someone else's curiosities. Is there a set up that would include head/cam/PCM/plus ?? specs that's been installed multiple times and proven to not throw codes and require additional tuning and additional trouble shooting?

[ViperTony]

Originally Posted by rcdice

Do any of the known tuners have a head/cam package that's been tested and proven to work? It seems like every time one of these threads gets started there are a bunch of ideas thrown out there but always with a "try this" approach.

I know for a fact that there are guys out there (like me) who would be willing to write a check to get the work done but DON'T want to be a guinea pig for someone else's curiosities. Is there a set up that would include head/cam/PCM/plus ?? specs that's been installed multiple times and proven to not throw codes and require additional tuning and additional trouble shooting?

Yes, there are many packages out there that work but the packages seem to be custom-tailored to the specific NA build and needs of the owner. What are you looking for? More torque down low in the RPM range, mid rand or high end? Is this for street, strip or track? What is your HP goal? etc, etc. What ends up happening is that you talk directly with the tuner to get into the details of what you really need. I'd venture to say every NA build is different. I'd start with Greg Good.

[Greg Good Cylinder Heads]

Originally Posted by rcdice

Do any of the known tuners have a head/cam package that's been tested and proven to work? It seems like every time one of these threads gets started there are a bunch of ideas thrown out there but always with a "try this" approach.

I know for a fact that there are guys out there (like me) who would be willing to write a check to get the work done but DON'T want to be a guinea pig for someone else's curiosities. Is there a set up that would include head/cam/PCM/plus ?? specs that's been installed multiple times and proven to not throw codes and require additional tuning and additional trouble shooting?

Here's a cam that I've sold many times, and it works REALLY good.

Comp Cams hydraulic roller:
3634 intake lobe / 232 @ .050" / .600" with a 1.7 rocker
3635 exhaust lobe / 236 @ .050" / .605" with a 1.7 rocker
114 lobe separation, and order it with 4 degrees of advance ground into it.

This cam will make upwards of 600 rwhp on a stock shortblock with a good set of heads, 1 & 3/4 primary tube headers, and no cats. It has enough vacuum to not make the engine go rich at idle, and will run with the stock PCM. It sounds really good at idle too.

For heads you can go with me, JM Cylinder Heads, or someone of equal quality. There are a lot of good head porters around.

Get some .027" Cometic head gaskets, and have the heads milled to 71-72 cc's so you have enough compression ratio.

Port match the intake. Put 3/8" diameter pushrods in it.

That cam likes 150-160 pounds of seat pressure, and 400-440 open pressure to stay out of valve float. It's not a spring killer at all. Gentle on parts.

Use good lifters. 96-99 model cars already have them. If you buy aftermarkets get the ones that have c-clips holding the axles in. There are some being sold that have *pressed in* axles and they fail pretty regularly.

Good luck.

[2001 GTS]

How did my old cam work out for you SquadX??

Any dyno numbers?

[RapidRonnie]

Hi.
This is my first post here but I am not new to the Viper engines. Without head work, a cam change won't net you much horsepower (15'-ish) as the heads and cam are already a pretty close match. The o.e.m. heads don't flow much past the .544 lift of the o.e.m. cam anyway. It is a fair bit of work to change one out.
WITH good heads and a cam however like Greg stated, horsepower and torque gains can be substantial. I have 577 wheel and 607 TQ (through an automatic transmission) running through Hi-Flow cats, without headers or even a cold air intake. The 5610 pound truck launched from a dead idle at a 3000 foot D.A. N.H.R.A. Corrected time at sea-level is 12.07 at 112.8 m.p.h. The engine in a Viper car @ sea-level could run a 10.6 @ 130 m.p.h. and likely get better gas mileage than a stocker... (My Quad Cab does).

Hope this helps

Ronnie

2005 Quad Cab- N.A. 1/4 Mile World Record Holder
Striker Heads, Jesels, Mild Custom Roller

STATS:

RAM SRT-10 Quad Cab N.A. 1/4 MILE WORLD RECORD RUN on Vimeo

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[Red Snake]

Originally Posted by RapidRonnie

Hi.
This is my first post here but I am not new to the Viper engines. Without head work, a cam change won't net you much horsepower (15'-ish) as the heads and cam are already a pretty close match. The o.e.m. heads don't flow much past the .544 lift of the o.e.m. cam anyway. It is a fair bit of work to change one out.
WITH good heads and a cam however like Greg stated, horsepower and torque gains can be substantial. I have 577 wheel and 607 TQ (through an automatic transmission) running through Hi-Flow cats, without headers or even a cold air intake. The 5610 pound truck launched from a dead idle at a 3000 foot D.A. N.H.R.A. Corrected time at sea-level is 12.07 at 112.8 m.p.h. The engine in a Viper car @ sea-level could run a 10.6 @ 130 m.p.h. and likely get better gas mileage than a stocker... (My Quad Cab does).

Hope this helps

Ronnie

2005 Quad Cab- N.A. 1/4 Mile World Record Holder
Striker Heads, Jesels, Mild Custom Roller

STATS:

RAM SRT-10 Quad Cab N.A. 1/4 MILE WORLD RECORD RUN on Vimeo

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Off topic, but how is that a "world record"?

What your times "would have been, corrected" don't count for a record. What you ran is what you ran.

There are N/A trucks running 12.2@112 and they are actually running that time, not correcting to it.

[RapidRonnie]

Originally Posted by Red Snake

Off topic, but how is that a "world record"?

What your times "would have been, corrected" don't count for a record. What you ran is what you ran.

There are N/A trucks running 12.2@112 and they are actually running that time, not correcting to it.

Agreed; the current Regular Cab record is actually 12.024 but my 12.53 is the current world record for a Naturally Aspirated Quad Cab without power adders of any kind. There is a distinction between the trucks on the forums.

Ronnie

[Red Snake]

Gotcha. I didn't realize there was a seperate record category for QCs.

[RapidRonnie]

Originally Posted by Red Snake

Gotcha. I didn't realize there was a seperate record category for QCs.

No problem. The guys in the "grocery getter" Quad Cabs get fun poked at them quite often!!
Anyway, the original intent of my post was to provide information as to what a cam and head package could do for a naturally aspirated engine...(even in a heavy truck). Add another 30 wheel to my numbers (for losses through the automatic) and the N.A. numbers (without headers) are pretty stout.

Ronnie

[2001 GTS]

Originally Posted by RapidRonnie

Hi.
This is my first post here but I am not new to the Viper engines. Without head work, a cam change won't net you much horsepower (15'-ish) as the heads and cam are already a pretty close match. The o.e.m. heads don't flow much past the .544 lift of the o.e.m. cam anyway. It is a fair bit of work to change one out.
WITH good heads and a cam however like Greg stated, horsepower and torque gains can be substantial. I have 577 wheel and 607 TQ (through an automatic transmission) running through Hi-Flow cats, without headers or even a cold air intake. The 5610 pound truck launched from a dead idle at a 3000 foot D.A. N.H.R.A. Corrected time at sea-level is 12.07 at 112.8 m.p.h. The engine in a Viper car @ sea-level could run a 10.6 @ 130 m.p.h. and likely get better gas mileage than a stocker... (My Quad Cab does).

Hope this helps

Ronnie

Good call on the viper car times! I ran a 10.84@128 with like a 2500 DA, with Greg's Heads and Solid Roller cam.

[RapidRonnie]

Originally Posted by 2001 GTS

Good call on the viper car times! I ran a 10.84@128 with like a 2500 DA, with Greg's Heads and Solid Roller cam.

I thought it should be close. I do all of my own work and I'm involved with some pretty high horsepower stuff up here in Calgary. The truck was more of an experiment than anything else...

Your time is a 10.5 @ 132 on a sea-level pass. That's rockin!!
The cam I have in the truck is a one-off (ground on a 114) and is really quite small. A guy could definitely go bigger to take advantage of the heads IF the engine were in a Viper car, but I was after TQ with the heft of the truck, not horsepower, especially with that power-robbing automatic Dodge chose to use...

Ronnie

[281cammer]

Man, I want to put a cam in my car. Greg one of these days I'm gonna get off my duff and order one from you.

[1BADGTS]

I used to run 11.2 at 132 (stock pilots )Hyd cam on pump gas with slicks my buddy same motor build up ran 10.5 at 134 plus both GEN 2 ALL MOTOR GTS.

[1BADGTS]

pS if one can run the times we used to run on pump gas with a hyd cam i never saw the point to run solid.

[Twister]

I was just gonna do the comp cam..dealership was gonna do it all for 2200 includeing price of cam/seals ect.....

Car was still gonna be warrantied so that what i cared about...Chuck tator told me that the cam only produced 5-12 rwhp on the dyno for peak power but the power under the curve was significant...

still might do it..

I put an aem on my gen2 and only gained 5 rwhp..but the pwower under the curve was 15-25 more rwhp in areas..

Did some 1/4 mile runs and that car went from averaging 119 mph to 122 mph with just the aem and 5 'peak rwhp"..

I still may do it..Maybe next month

[2001 GTS]

Originally Posted by 1BADGTS

I used to run 11.2 at 132 (stock pilots )Hyd cam on pump gas with slicks my buddy same motor build up ran 10.5 at 134 plus both GEN 2 ALL MOTOR GTS.

Too bad there is no proof.