Get more boost from your Roe Blower!

[mntngts99]

This thread is like a dead body,,, You don't want to look but you have tooo.. Someone please put a white sheet over it.

So,,,,, Tony are you going to Utah to see Todd ?? If so Can you come tune my car ?

[Joseph Dell]

This is almost as painful as the Vipair thread!

But seriously. Let's blame some people here

I call [******] on the altitude stuff. As tony pointed out, that is negligible. And you'll see greater swings in a day.

As Kenny pointed out, Kenny doesn't have a card reader (though he clearly has a computer) but not the VEC2 software so he is making the tuning a bit more challenging from afar.

Larry is guilty of not judging his customer's tollerence for something that isn't 100% perfect. In retrospect, Larry might even wish that he'd declined the build if he knew what care and feeding this was going to take.

Kenny is guilt of not taking any direct responsibility for learning what was going on with his car. Some will argue that he shouldn't have to b/c he paid 27k of his daughter's college money that should have gone to his Ex to get his car rebuild.

Sadly, the car just needs a) some face time w/ a tuner and b) some minor care and feeding.

Group hug?

Here are JD's tips for remote tuning a VEC2 (aka: things I insist people tell me before i start working a problem):

- At what RPM did XXX occur?
- Does XXX stay this way or does it go away?
- What is the A/F ratio at XXX (per the gauge which Kenny still doesn't have. *prod*)
- What color was the smoke (if any)?
- What did the boost gauge read at XXX?
- What temp was it outside when XXX was occuring?
- Describe the symptoms in terms of what happened at what RPM?

These are just STARTERS. But with this info, one can BEGIN to start to remote tune a car. No A/F meter and no boost gauge = NO REMOTE TUNING. Or it ='s crazy/stupid remote tuning.

End rant... for the moment.

Group hug #2?

JD

[plumcrazy]

<<--- now looking for a future boost gauge..

Here are JD's tips for remote tuning a VEC2 (aka: things I insist people tell me before i start working a problem):

- At what RPM did XXX occur?
- Does XXX stay this way or does it go away?
- What is the A/F ratio at XXX (per the gauge which Kenny still doesn't have. *prod*)
- What color was the smoke (if any)?
- What did the boost gauge read at XXX?
- What temp was it outside when XXX was occuring?
- Describe the symptoms in terms of what happened at what RPM?

These are just STARTERS. But with this info, one can BEGIN to start to remote tune a car. No A/F meter and no boost gauge = NO REMOTE TUNING. Or it ='s crazy/stupid remote tuning.

End rant... for the moment.

Group hug #2?

JD

The A/F meter and the boost gauge were never part of Sir Larry's estimates or did he ever discuss the need for me to have them.

I did Emails stating at what RPM did XXX occur, did XXX stay this way or does it go away, the temp and humidity it was outside when XXX was occuring, and also desribed the symptoms in terms of what happened at what RPM.

Larry was able to retune my VEC2 cards once and have it run better under throttle and at higher RPM quite nicely, but the major problems of low RPM surging, hard starting, high idle hang up, barely running because the cam required a higher idle speed, and cold start loop problems causing the engine to warm up in garage and be shut off and restarted to be able to run on the street have never gotten better.

I haven't received the latest updated VEC2 cards that a friend with a Roe VEC2 software writer was planning on writing for me from Sir Larry's Emails to him with the programs attached. Perhaps when I try them out my car will run right. I sure hope so. He was supposed to have done it already today, but he hasn't returned my calls yet.

I would love to do Group hug #2 and be satisfied Sir Larry has delivered what he promised and put an end to all of this.

[Simms]

After talking to them I don't feel very comfortable about having my Viper being tuned down in Florida, since the reason why it wasn't tuned right when it was delivered to me as being completed was the altitude difference between Florida and Ohio and other reasons I'm not going into here.

Kenny, that is the dumbest crap I have ever heard. Sounds like some of the information you are getting from "previous customers" is a load of [******] to discredit Larry for whatever reason they have.

My car was tuned in the 96 degree florida heat then brought up here to Pittsburgh. The car has run PERFECT since the day it left well over a year ago. The tune has never needed to be touched! Dave's car and Tony's car have ran just fine from the Florida tune to Ohio. Adjustments to their cars were only made in conjuction to upgrades.

Great post Joseph Dell!

Kenny, that is the dumbest crap I have ever heard. Sounds like some of the information you are getting from "previous customers" is a load of [******] to discredit Larry for whatever reason they have.

My car was tuned in the 96 degree florida heat then brought up here to Pittsburgh. The car has run PERFECT since the day it left well over a year ago. The tune has never needed to be touched! Dave's car and Tony's car have ran just fine from the Florida tune to Ohio. Adjustments to their cars were only made in conjuction to upgrades.

Great post Joseph Dell!

What other people have told me is heresay and not admissable in a court of law, however more than a few said they would testify in a court of law if need be and more said they would post their experiences in a new thread. This thread will fade from view since the thread's title does not give a clue as to what is contained inside and I don't think continuing the hijacking is proper. If more needs to be said on this subject it will be done in a new thread where the title of the thread reflects what is contained inside. I will not comment on Tony's car since I have heard different. Why Larry told me it was the difference in altitude between Florida and Ohio that made my car run so poorly becomes even more of a mystery then.

I just want my car to be what Larry Macedo promised it would be without having to keep spending more and more of my money to make it right. I'm hoping the latest VEC2 cards, whenever I do get them will solve my car's problems and I can post nothing but praise for Sir Larry. Larry led me to believe I would be getting what you got from him - "The car has run PERFECT since the day it left well over a year ago. The tune has never needed to be touched!"

[Simms]

Kenny, I hope very much you get what you were promised as well. And I believe you will. But I also think Larry would appreciate you giving him the chance to properly adjust the car as well before voicing your opinions on the internet.

As far as what "others" have told you, I can tell you just the same about every other tuner on here (there is always a disgruntle customer and a story). I however, would never do that. The reference to crap was to you not being comfortable with a tune from Florida now. Any adjustments that a tuner feels are necessary could be made to deal with the differences in altitude. Depending on the build, it may take more adjustments.

As far as Tony's car (now Dave's), the current issue was taken car of with new O2 sensors. This is coming from Dave himself and Bobby. Don't forget, that car was originally tuned YEARS ago with no issues.

Don't take this the wrong way, but I believe your lack of knowledge is letting others influence you.

I sure hope you get your super daily driving no code throwing etc. car. You have already invested a lot, let Larry fix you up and get your car where it needs to be.

[newredrt10]

Lets put an end to this.

Kenny

I think you should step back a minute and rethink the situation. When I talked to you on the phone you said there were many people upset with Larry on this thread. That is not what I have read. The problem with your car could be as simple as a vacum leak. The transporting of a car can cause many things to come loose. The electrical problem may also be a lose wire from transportion. As far as the parts on the car you yourself stated to me that you selected the parts. Give Larry a chance to look at the car and evaluate the problem. He has not had this chance and it could be a very simple fix. I know both of you would feel bad about it if it was a simple fix. Make a phone call to Larry and make a honest effort to correct this situation. My offer to take your car to Larry still stands.

[GARY J]

I haven't read this whole thread, but I think I get the jist of it. I know a lot of friends that have given their opinions in here, and I don't want to step on any toes, but here is the way I see it. Larry is not some small shop up the road that was just going to take a crack at building a viper. He is an established viper tuner that works on these cars for a living. Kenny paid $28k for this build. He already had the Roe blower. To me, it looks like Larry charged $28k for a built motor, some heads and a tune. That's a premium price in my book.

Just to put it into perspective, I paid just a little more than that to build my blue car, including twin turbos, AEM, and a few other goodies. I can tell you right now, if my blue car would have showed up running like Kenny's car, Gary Almond would have taken it right back to Heffner's shop on their dime and I wouldn't have wanted it back until it ran as promised.

I hope everything works out well because I like all of you guys (Larry, Kenny Ian, Etc.), but I don't think Kenny should have to spend another dime. He already paid for a car that runs well, and that's that. Good luck guys.

Lets put an end to this.

I want to step back a minute and rethink the situation, too. I have gotten a lot of advice and knowledge from all the people I've talked with both in public and in private. Larry posted I should take my car to Joe Donovan and Joe plans on coming to Ohio this coming Friday to check my car and VEC2 programs to see if he can find any easy fix. I also want to talk with my lawyer again before I decide any course of action.

When I talked to you on the phone I said there were many people upset with Larry from reading this thread and have talked with me in private - only a fraction have posted here which is why there are so few.

I, above all, want this to end as soon as possible and have a super reliable daily driver that throws no codes and has a lot more power Viper. I also don't want to have to take out another loan to keep paying for more parts. I also can't afford to take off from work when I already am paying on a $27,000 loan.

I work for two school systems and only get paid if I work. Larry has already been paid almost $28,000. Larry gets $125/hr; I get $87.50/day and $75/day depending on which school system I work for. School starts August 29th.

[2MANYTOYS]

I haven't read this whole thread, but I think I get the jist of it. I know a lot of friends that have given their opinions in here, and I don't want to step on any toes, but here is the way I see it. Larry is not some small shop up the road that was just going to take a crack at building a viper. He is an established viper tuner that works on these cars for a living. Kenny paid $28k for this build. He already had the Roe blower. To me, it looks like Larry charged $28k for a built motor, some heads and a tune. That's a premium price in my book.

Just to put it into perspective, I paid just a little more than that to build my blue car, including twin turbos, AEM, and a few other goodies. I can tell you right now, if my blue car would have showed up running like Kenny's car, Gary Almond would have taken it right back to Heffner's shop on their dime and I wouldn't have wanted it back until it ran as promised.

I hope everything works out well because I like all of you guys (Larry, Kenny Ian, Etc.), but I don't think Kenny should have to spend another dime. He already paid for a car that runs well, and that's that. Good luck guys.

I agree Gary good post. The man didn't get what he paid for end of story.

Simms please stop with the excuses, does Larry pay you to be his spokesman??

[Simms]

Simms please stop with the excuses, does Larry pay you to be his spokesman??

What excuses have I given???? We all know you have a hard on for Larry, and like to bash him at any chance you get. And no, I'm not a spokesman.

Excuses??? Non given. Just a statement to let him try to justify the situation before he is attacked publicly.

[superdavz]

Kenny I have read most of your post and I don’t understand getting on a public forum and trashing the guy that built your car with out giving him time to fix the problem.

As for the $28,000 you spent lets tell everyone that you wanted to get a set of heads for the car that run $8000 of that cost as well as a roll bar and a few other accessories not to mention the complete engine rebuild.

I have 2 M2 cars and they both run great, so good that I won the Viper Nationals with one of them.

You mentioned that you had to talk to your lawyer, what the hel@ are you talking about. Be careful not letting someone have a chance to fix the problem could come back and bite you hard! Its called slander!

[1TONY1]

This thread is like a dead body,,, You don't want to look but you have tooo.. Someone please put a white sheet over it.

So,,,,, Tony are you going to Utah to see Todd ?? If so Can you come tune my car ?

If I fly to Utah.....I will have to do something to buy fuel for the return trip Paid $5.something a gallon in Destin Fl. today. But really, I'm thinking a trip out to see the wonderful scenery again and not working on cars It's down hill back to ga....... I'll coast back. LOL

p.s. Todd my have other plans for me though

[2MANYTOYS]

What excuses have I given???? We all know you have a hard on for Larry, and like to bash him at any chance you get. And no, I'm not a spokesman.

Excuses??? Non given. Just a statement to let him try to justify the situation before he is attacked publicly.

Re-read your posts you ignore the obvious and seem to blame Kenny for his car not running well. I have nothing against Larry. The small amount of work he did on my car was fine. It cost to much but the work was fine. I wouldn't give a [******] who the tuner was that includes UR who still has some issues they are working on clearing up on my car. This isn't a vendetta against Larry. His public responses here were pathetic at best. He's been paid and the car runs like [******]. Kenny never should have been expected to accept the car in that condition. It should have been tuned properly before it left the shop. This is not hard to understand I don't know why it seems to go over your head.

[2MANYTOYS]

Kenny I have read most of your post and I don’t understand getting on a public forum and trashing the guy that built your car with out giving him time to fix the problem.

As for the $28,000 you spent lets tell everyone that you wanted to get a set of heads for the car that run $8000 of that cost as well as a roll bar and a few other accessories not to mention the complete engine rebuild.

I have 2 M2 cars and they both run great, so good that I won the Viper Nationals with one of them.

You mentioned that you had to talk to your lawyer, what the hel@ are you talking about. Be careful not letting someone have a chance to fix the problem could come back and bite you hard! Its called slander!

Slander??? Yeah right, his car doesn't run and he tells the truth about it and it's slander???? You M2 boys drink too much kool-aid

[newredrt10]

Slander??? Yeah right, his car doesn't run and he tells the truth about it and it's slander???? You M2 boys drink too much kool-aid

You better besure what the true is for the complete true has not been told.

[2MANYTOYS]

You better besure what the true is for the complete true has not been told.

Let's hear it hot rod! Nothing the M2 crew has said makes any sense so far.

[Simms]

Re-read your posts you ignore the obvious and seem to blame Kenny for his car not running well. I have nothing against Larry. The small amount of work he did on my car was fine. It cost to much but the work was fine. I wouldn't give a [******] who the tuner was that includes UR who still has some issues they are working on clearing up on my car. This isn't a vendetta against Larry. His public responses here were pathetic at best. He's been paid and the car runs like [******]. Kenny never should have been expected to accept the car in that condition. It should have been tuned properly before it left the shop. This is not hard to understand I don't know why it seems to go over your head.

Let me dumb this down even further for you. No, I do not blame Kenny AT ALL for his car not running correctly. I do think he could have handled it differently. He has publicly stated that he and Larry are working on it. That should have been the end of it. If the car did not run properly after Larry had the chance to retune it, and refused to deal with the issue, then I could see it. You are not on hear complaining about your tuner, you are letting them deal with the issues first. You clearly are not aware of all the facts.

Some of my points are the same as Joe Dell, yet you have nothing to say to Joe because he is not an M2 customer.

Larry's public responses are pathetic how? Its whether or not he fixes the that car that counts.

[Simms]

Let's hear it hot rod! Nothing the M2 crew has said makes any sense so far.

I guess having the original tuner adjust the tune before all the drama doesn't make sense.

[newredrt10]

It's for Kenny to say. I already tried too get it straighten out between them but it did not work. Kenny is so worked up over this, he is forgetting what he is saying to whom. I understand what he is going through, for I went through this exact thing with my car at an another tuner. It took a freind to step in an get things worked out. I hope some one will be able to do this here.

[2MANYTOYS]

Let me dumb this down even further for you. No, I do not blame Kenny AT ALL for his car not running correctly. I do think he could have handled it differently. He has publicly stated that he and Larry are working on it. That should have been the end of it. If the car did not run properly after Larry had the chance to retune it, and refused to deal with the issue, then I could see it. You are not on hear complaining about your tuner, you are letting them deal with the issues first. You clearly are not aware of all the facts.

Some of my points are the same as Joe Dell, yet you have nothing to say to Joe because he is not an M2 customer.

Larry's public responses are pathetic how? Its whether or not he fixes the that car that counts.

First of all did Larry not make a post telling Kenny to let Joe Donovan tune it??????

Second re-read my post a couple pages back I specifically told Joe I disagreed with him.

As for Larry's post why don't you re-read what he wrote and how he blasted Johnny Bravo for no reason

Simms please wipe the sh_t from your eyes and read these posts. I'm tired of telling you to re-read something.

You are right about one thing though. I probably don't know all the facts. But I can read and from the first post Kenny made until now it's clear he didn't get what he paid for. Instead his car was delivered back to him unfinished.

Regardless this is not my car and I'm through defending Kenny. I just can't stand when someone has been wronged and they get ganged by the tuners nutswingers.

[2MANYTOYS]

It's for Kenny to say. I already tried too get it straighten out between them but it did not work. Kenny is so worked up over this, he is forgetting what he is saying to whom. I understand what he is going through, for I went through this exact thing with my car at an another tuner. It took a freind to step in an get things worked out. I hope some one will be able to do this here.

Who is the tuner? We should all know so someone else doesn't have to go through this crap.

[Shelby3]

I haven't read this whole thread, but I think I get the jist of it. I know a lot of friends that have given their opinions in here, and I don't want to step on any toes, but here is the way I see it. Larry is not some small shop up the road that was just going to take a crack at building a viper. He is an established viper tuner that works on these cars for a living. Kenny paid $28k for this build. He already had the Roe blower. To me, it looks like Larry charged $28k for a built motor, some heads and a tune. That's a premium price in my book.

Just to put it into perspective, I paid just a little more than that to build my blue car, including twin turbos, AEM, and a few other goodies. I can tell you right now, if my blue car would have showed up running like Kenny's car, Gary Almond would have taken it right back to Heffner's shop on their dime and I wouldn't have wanted it back until it ran as promised.

I hope everything works out well because I like all of you guys (Larry, Kenny Ian, Etc.), but I don't think Kenny should have to spend another dime. He already paid for a car that runs well, and that's that. Good luck guys.

That's a good post right there..................

[newredrt10]

The problem has been corrected to my satisfaction, and the tuner has correct the problem with there organization. So there is no reason to air it again here.

As for the $28,000 you spent lets tell everyone that you wanted to get a set of heads for the car that run $8000 of that cost as well as a roll bar and a few other accessories not to mention the complete engine rebuild.

Dave, the heads were $6,500, the custom roll bar was $2,000. I think I had already told everyone that I had new forged pistons and a lot of engine work and etc. done at the same time plus a new $3,000 fuel system upgrade.

I have 2 M2 cars and they both run great, so good that I won the Viper Nationals with one of them.

My M2 Viper also won Fastest Viper on Street Tires, even though it blew fuses and shut down the engine on both it's first two runs. I am not disputing my car running great on the track (except for the fuses blowing) - it's the daily driver reliability at normal low 25 MPH speeds in residential areas and city speed limits of 35 MPH that are the problem. I drive my Viper to the track, on the track, and home from the track - I don't believe a sports car should be trailered - that's why daily driver reliability is so important to me.

You mentioned that you had to talk to your lawyer, what the hel@ are you talking about. Be careful not letting someone have a chance to fix the problem could come back and bite you hard! Its called slander!

Nothing I have said is slanderous - everything is the truth. Talking to a lawyer for advice on a matter as complex as this is prudent. I much prefer to settle this out of court. I just want the car that was promised me at the price promised me without me having to keep paying more and more money for things not in the original estimates. I am letting Larry work on fixing the problem - he has reprogrammed the VEC2 programs of his first try. He said it himself that my tuning problems were due to Ohio being so much higher in altitude over Florida and it would appear to a normal person that then my car should be retuned in Ohio so it will run right here where it will be driven.

Kenny I have read most of your post and I don’t understand getting on a public forum and trashing the guy that built your car with out giving him time to fix the problem.

I've had the car delivered much later than it was promised giving him ample time (2 months from when the engine was completed and installed and first started up) to have it tuned and it was delivered to me as being completed except for the 500 mile break in and it ran totally unacceptable with surging from the first day it was returned to me on July 1, 2006. It is now over a month and a half later and only the second retry to get it to run right is being tried tomorrow. This does not seem to me to be really trying to get it fixed.

Slander??? Yeah right, his car doesn't run and he tells the truth about it and it's slander???? You M2 boys drink too much kool-aid

Hey! I'm a M2 boy now, too!

And I don't drink kool-aid!

[2MANYTOYS]

Hey! I'm a M2 boy now, too!

And I don't drink kool-aid!

LOL me neither it gives me heartburn.

[mntngts99]

Why cant you guys do all this with PM's

[RedGTS]

Speaking of PM's, 2Many needs to check his.

Now back to "As the Tuner Turns. . . ."