Head Bolts

I'm putting in an upper engine gasket kit. Can I use the original head bolts again?

I did

Yes you can.
New metal gaskets - torque head bolts to 120 ft lbs!

I'm sure others are more knowledgeable, but I was always told to use new bolts as they actually stretch once installed.

I made sure that I got all new head bolts along with my upper gasket kit, as I heard that the bolts were a torque-to-yield design, i.e. a kind that experiences an irreversable amount of stretching during the final torquing step. As such, re-using them would not guarantee a correct clamping force.

Checking my service manual now, though, there is no mention of a requirement to replace the head bolts. It simply says to "tighten the cylinder head bolts" to 30 ft-lb in the proper sequence and then give 'em all another 1/4 turn. Browsing other parts of section 9 of the service manual also gives NO mention to new head bolts.

I would think that Dodge would have a side note when a person orders a set of head gaskets that they would tell you to also order head bolts. It's probably a good idea, but if everyone else isn't having problems I'll just use the old bolts.

Should I have them plane the heads a little for more compression or just have them resurfaced. Any suggestions?

you can reuse them long as they are not streched. if you have to get new ones then i would spend extra dollar and buy head studs. head studs are stronger. ARP makes one for viper.

p.s
i reused my original head bolts. arrow told me not to go over 110pounds.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by v8huntr:

p.s
i reused my original haed bolts. arrow told me not to go over 110pounds.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

"Arrow" told me to go to 120 ft lbs.w/new gaskets.
The bolts should be good for at least two gasket jobs.
[I've done 22 motors this way.]

Viper1994,
Lay a straight edge on the heads and if there ok? Just clean them up and install them.

Just curious if the gen 1 and gen 2 would be the same? How tight do you torque both? Can you reuse the bolts for both engines?

thanks,
Max

Whoa! Lets hold it right there. Gen 1s have larger head bolts than gen 2s. NEVER torque stock gen 2 head bolts to more than the factory recommended 90 foot pounds. When they determine a torque spec there are many things taken into account such as: Bolt stretch, that is all that torquing is, tightening a bolt to a specified stretch length, 2 how much torque the threads in the block can handle, you guys sure would be hati'n life if you pulled the threads out of your block or broke a head bolt, and one thing everyone seems to overlook is the fact that the tighter you torque the head bolts, the more you distort the block and cylinder walls. That's why they use torque plates when a block is bored or honed, because the shape of the cylinder walls changes when the head gets tightened down. Do yourself a favor, if your going to use stock head bolts, torque them exactly how the service manual specifies. Viper94, I know you have a gen1, I just want to make sure nobody gets confused and causes themself a lot of unnecessary trouble. Max, yes you can reuse the stock head bolts, however I would not recommend reusing them more than once. Torque for gen 1 and 2 are different. For your car you should first torque them to 45 then go to 90, start in the center and work your way out, torque the small bolts to 95 inch pounds, make sure that there is no coolant in the bolt holes and no oil on the threads, there is a coating on the bolts that promotes proper torquing. If there is coolant in the bolt holes, it could be compressed by the bolt and cause the block to crack. Always go over them at least two times.

I'M DOING A TOP END JOB ON MY GEN1 AND I CALLED ARROW TODAY.THEY TOLD ME THE SAME THING THAT JASON AND CHUCK SAID. FINAL HEAD BOLT TORQUE SHOULD BE 120#. THEY ALSO SAID THAT THE BOLTS HAVE A COATING AND NOT TO USE ANY ASSEMBLY LUBE OR LOCKTITE. ALSO ADVISED THAT THE BOLTS COULD BE REUSED AS LONG AS THE THREADS LOOK GOOD AND ARE NOT RUSTED. INCIDENTALLY, THE ARROW PEOPLE WERE VERY HELPFUL AND FRIENDLY. IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIOINS, I'M SURE THAT THEY WOULD BE HAPPY TO HELP YOU OUT.
BEST OF LUCK!!

Torquing high tensile steel bolts into aluminum threads is not the place to deviate from factory recommended specs. If the book says "dry threads" then do it that way.

Hold on! Stop the presses! :
I stopped in mid-post to run get my service manual. Very interestingly, it says to torque the head bolts to 47N-m (35lb-ft) then torque them an additional 1/4 turn. Next, tighten the valley bolts to 11 N-m (95 lb-in).

Large diesel engines frequently call for torquing to a certain level, then an additional "turn of the nut/bolt." It looks to me like we have a significant difference on recommended torque procedure for the Gen2 motors. I would probably defer to the later specs, but not knowing any different, I would go "by the book."

So tell me Mr. Wizard - what is the correct torque for '96 Gen2 head bolts?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by GTS Dean:

So tell me Mr. Wizard - what is the correct torque for '96 Gen2 head bolts?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Final torque on GENII Head bolts: 90 ft lbs. & Valley bolts to 95 in lbs.

Final torque on GENI Head bolts <u> WITH NEW STEEL GASKETS</u> 120 ft lbs. & Valley bolts 95 in lbs.

But what do I know, last week i coodint spell mer-can-ick now i R one.

Thanks Jason and Viper Wizard. Can you reuse the gen 2 head bolts?
The reason I asked because we are going to be upgrading our heads soon.

Max

Your welcome Max! YES you can reuse bolts as long as they look alright.

Any bolts that specify to torqe them to a certain spec and then specify another 1/4 turn or 1/2 turn are called torque to yield bolts and should never be reused. Your service manual for that partixular year may also recommend that you replace the bolts. I have not seen that in the manual for any other year Viper.

(bump)

Good info!

Thanks for all the responses, this has helped me a lot. We are starting on it today. I will let you guy's know how it turns out.