Will the 2009 Viper get a HP boost to Head off the ZR-1?

[vipeuup]

There was one guy with a 08 Viper. The car had 1700miles on it, and it dynoed 560rwhp and 525ftlbs torque. Bonestock. Bonestock down to the paper airfilters. Im thinking that these new Vipers are putting out alot more than whats being disclosed. Secondly making more power with more miles on them to. That 560rwhp is right up there with the ZR1. Its going to be a good race between these 2. And of course the ZR1 definetly getting beat on the road course due to the heatsoak.

[Bobpantax]

Originally Posted by Flash1034

With the stated HP rating of the new 09 ZR-1 at "620+" HP, do you guys think the 2009 Viper will get a HP boost to head off the competitor? It would seem that with the 10 cylinders and relatively low compression ratio of the Viper, an extra amount of HP wouldnt be all that hard to do, but Im no engineer. What do you guys think? Any Viper rumors brewing?
Flash

I asked Dick Winkles whether there were any plans to increase the HP beyond 600 at the recent Mar a Lago event. His answer was: "No". The ACR will exceed the road course performance of the ZR1 without any additional mods. SRT was aware of the ZR1 while they were creating the ACR and took it into consideration. How do I know this? Herb H. told me. As to the quarter mile, we will have to wait and see. The Aerodynamics and downforce of the ACR are phenominal.

[Les Quam]

I agree with Bill Pemberton and others I think the ACR is Dodge's answer to the current ZR1. The ACR given equal drivers will post significantly lower lap times than a stock ZR1. The 08 Viper will probably lose a few street races though? The question is whether Chevy comes out with a track ready version of it's ZR1?

I can't see how anyone could be disappointed with the performance of the new Viper? You have the options of a drop top vintage Shelby Cobra style 600 HP Viper, a coupe Viper or a true track ready ACR Viper all with 600 screaming ponies. Not to mention a bunch of low volume colors and interior options.

[SylvanSRT]

Another to throw an opinion in the hat, and I also agree with Bill P. the extra weight of the ZR-1 over the ZO6 and heat soak of the S/C will not bring consistently faster lap times than the ACR and poss. even the reg SRT-10

[Andrew/USPWR]

Dodge could get 20hp out of just changing the chip. I like it dependable.

[black mamba1]

Hey guys,

If you go back and look at the last SRT engineers discussion, I asked the SRT engineer point blank, "Is the ACR Dodge's response to the ZR1?".

The engineer responded, "Yes, and you will like it!".

The Zr1 will be a monster in straightline acceleration w/ its 3:42 gearing. The main problem for this car will be yes, traction. W/ the roots style blower and power coming on early in the power band I think it will be a major challenge to get the car to stick, but Chevy spent millions to solve that problem (magnetic suspension and other goodies). The best Gen 4 time we have seen so far is 11.18, and that was w/ a quaife and 3:33's. I think the best stock Gen 4 time we have seen is like 11.4-ish.

SRT mentioned in Viper Magazine that to tweak even 20 more hp would have required all kinds of expensive testing and recertification, etc. But I think if Dodge simply offered a 3:33 or 3:45 gearing option, we would be neck in neck w/ the Zr1. Road and Track is predicting 11.2 in the 1/4 for the Zr1.

NOW, if Cerebus steps up to the plate and really commits to the Viper, they could simply offer the Mopar packaged option for the Gen 4 and that car should make 680-700 hp, now you are talking about a car that will run mid to low 10's!

[Nsane1]

To the OP question: "No" is the answer. 1) It costs too much (they aren't putting money into the to recertify and engine 2) RWHP wise, I bet the viper has more already, and IF not, simply add the mopar package, and that's the answer 3) ACR handles it very well.

[ViperNM]

Originally Posted by black mamba1

SRT mentioned in Viper Magazine that to tweak even 20 more hp would have required all kinds of expensive testing and recertification, etc. But I think if Dodge simply offered a 3:33 or 3:45 gearing option, we would be neck in neck w/ the Zr1. Road and Track is predicting 11.2 in the 1/4 for the Zr1.

Road & Crap is predicting what? Vaporware is what I call it. Until a production representative ZR-1 becomes available it's all wishful thinking (at least to R&T and the rest of the bow tie crowd)

Originally Posted by black mamba1

NOW, if Cerebus steps up to the plate and really commits to the Viper, they could simply offer the Mopar packaged option for the Gen 4 and that car should make 680-700 hp, now you are talking about a car that will run mid to low 10's!

I have about as much confidence in Cerebus doing good by the Viper as I do in R&T's ability to be objective!

[black mamba1]

I will say this again, dont sleep on Chevy. Those boys have deep pockets over there and a Vette following that makes us look like a minor cult.

Do you really think Chevy would build a Vette and create all this hoopla and charge 100k for it if it only marginally outperforms the Z06? No way jose, not in a million years. I am telling you....that Zr1 is going to be everything Chevy is touting. It will suck as a track car, but they have already said the Z06 will remain their track car. But in a straight line, it will be one mean bitch.

[Bobpantax]

If by Mopar package, everyone is referring to the enhancements that were on the carbon Viper at the auto show, such a package is not going to be produced. Mopar has indicated that since the Viper is produced in such low numbers, it will not be doing such a package for the Gen IV. Part of the issue is that to do the package correctly, per Dick Winkles, certain programming tweaks are required. Of course that does not prevent Viperheads from otherwise modding their cars since the carbon Viper package was for off road use only anyway. Also, as long as the subject has to do with modding the Gen IV, Dick also said that he would not increase the HP of the car beyond the stock 600 HP without changing out the pistons. He said they are the same pistons used in the SRT 8's and are good pistins but not meant for use beyond 600 HP. The new engine is a fine piece but far more complicated than the Gen III and Gen II engines. The additional complexity creates a more challenging environment within which to implement modifications.

[Tusc]

Gentlemen, continue.

So the first ACRs have been / are being delivered now, yes? I imagine it won't be more than a month before we begin seeing solid times out of them and discovering how the aerodynamics affect 1/4 traps.

ZR1... we can balk at it all we want, but even we are only taking educated guesses at it like R&T until someone puts it on a straight section of asphalt. I guarantee they are going to be bringing along a pickup with a bed full of crushed ice and some big fans with a tent though. The body on that car may be goofy looking, but the drivetrain remains a sledgehammer of a V8.

[fastmd]

Originally Posted by Tusc

Gentlemen, continue.

So the first ACRs have been / are being delivered now, yes? I imagine it won't be more than a month before we begin seeing solid times out of them and discovering how the aerodynamics affect 1/4 traps.

ZR1... we can balk at it all we want, but even we are only taking educated guesses at it like R&T until someone puts it on a straight section of asphalt. I guarantee they are going to be bringing along a pickup with a bed full of crushed ice and some big fans with a tent though. The body on that car may be goofy looking, but the drivetrain remains a sledgehammer of a V8.

No ACRs have been delivered yet

[fastmd]

Originally Posted by Bobpantax

If by Mopar package, everyone is referring to the enhancements that were on the carbon Viper at the auto show, such a package is not going to be produced. Mopar has indicated that since the Viper is produced in such low numbers, it will not be doing such a package for the Gen IV. Part of the issue is that to do the package correctly, per Dick Winkles, certain programming tweaks are required. Of course that does not prevent Viperheads from otherwise modding their cars since the carbon Viper package was for off road use only anyway. Also, as long as the subject has to do with modding the Gen IV, Dick also said that he would not increase the HP of the car beyond the stock 600 HP without changing out the pistons. He said they are the same pistons used in the SRT 8's and are good pistins but not meant for use beyond 600 HP. The new engine is a fine piece but far more complicated than the Gen III and Gen II engines. The additional complexity creates a more challenging environment within which to implement modifications.

So are you saying that with adding headers/corsa etc., the pistons should be changed

[Andrew/USPWR]

Originally Posted by black mamba1

Hey guys,

If you go back and look at the last SRT engineers discussion, I asked the SRT engineer point blank, "Is the ACR Dodge's response to the ZR1?".

The engineer responded, "Yes, and you will like it!".

The Zr1 will be a monster in straightline acceleration w/ its 3:42 gearing. The main problem for this car will be yes, traction. W/ the roots style blower and power coming on early in the power band I think it will be a major challenge to get the car to stick, but Chevy spent millions to solve that problem (magnetic suspension and other goodies). The best Gen 4 time we have seen so far is 11.18, and that was w/ a quaife and 3:33's. I think the best stock Gen 4 time we have seen is like 11.4-ish.

SRT mentioned in Viper Magazine that to tweak even 20 more hp would have required all kinds of expensive testing and recertification, etc. But I think if Dodge simply offered a 3:33 or 3:45 gearing option, we would be neck in neck w/ the Zr1. Road and Track is predicting 11.2 in the 1/4 for the Zr1.

NOW, if Cerebus steps up to the plate and really commits to the Viper, they could simply offer the Mopar packaged option for the Gen 4 and that car should make 680-700 hp, now you are talking about a car that will run mid to low 10's!

Dick Winkle told us at our Mar-A-Largo luncheon, that while they put 1000lbs of down force on the ACR for better handling. Chevrolets Z06 took off down force ( minus –246ibs ) at the same speed just to give it a higher top end speed. Scary

[pteam]

Doesnt the supercharger of the ZR1 take horsepower to run it? So wouldn't 620 hp actually be less than the vipers 600 n/a? Also in low revs the supercharger won't have boost thus the n/a viper engine would have advantage there also. The problem might be is the zr1 supercharger might be easily modded with just a new pulley on the supercharger which could add who knows 20-50 more hp.