Vette/Viper Auto-Cross in New England.....VETTE owners...

[-RUNNR]

I was refraining from posting on the events of yesterday until someone else did. So here goes....

The day as a whole, was an ok day. We had fun, watched a lot of spectacular runs (Porsche 550, VW Golf) and watched a few bad runs (Mustangs, sliding Vipers).

Two things really upset me however.

Mike, you kick butt on drags, and you seem to be a great guy, but tires do not get "greasy". You was coming in too hot, and the snake simply would not stop. Please don't try to make up lame excuses like greasy tires dude. Just tell it like it is. We could all use some practice when it comes to this type of driving. I know I could. There is no shame in learning the car, but to make up bad excuses, well... (no offense intended at all Mike)

Secondly, the Vette dudes did piss me off a bit. There are some good guys there, but they seem to forget that we are out there for fun. We are not there in a battle of who's car is the best. If that was the case, we all know who would come out on top. I, like Tony, stood behind several vette guys while they would just non stop talk sh*t about the Viper, with several of them nonstop mocking Mike.

It seems that we Vipers owners have the correct mentality, have the Vette owners forgotten it? This is not a war. This is a friendly, fun, learning experience. At least it is supposed to be.

As for myself, I don't feel that I have a need to explain myself, but I will. I was ragged on a LOT by both Vette and Viper guys (mainly Vette owners) on why I didn't run yesterday. I have severe arthritis in my left shoulder and upper back which some days kills me to no end. Yes, arthritis at 34. Some days driving my snake to work hurts me badly enough. It took me about 2.5 hours yesterday to get down there. Think I felt like driving in an Autocross??? So please, if someone says they are not running in an event, and would rather just spectate, get off their backs please. There is a lot you may be unaware of.

Just my $0.02.

Flame suit is donned, and ready for the replies...

 

[Mike Brunton]

I am dragging this post back up from the depths of Viper world... just found it while searching the archives and reading it pissed me off quite a bit.

Don,

When did I say my tires were "greasy"? I said they were not sticking anything like they did when they were new. How many miles on your Viper? Do you know *anything* about tires? If you think tires with ~25k miles that are down to the wearbars stick like new ones, then you're nuts. How many times have you Autocrossed? I have done about 6 in the Viper, and although I am not very good at it, I usually run in the top 10% in times. I know *very* well how my car handles and turns. Yeah, I was going into turn 1 too hot for the condition of the tires, but I hadn't pushed the car in a long time, and I was very surprised how bad the tires are.

How many events have you actually participated in? If I remember correctly, you watched at the autocross and refused to get on the track, even after we were all trying to convince you it would be fun - to the point where you seemed irritated that anyone was actually asking you to join in. You watched at the first couple of drag days and refused to participate - the only time we actually lined up against one another, I absolutely SMOKED you, and you spouted off excuses about "I missed a shift, and I spun, and I missed a gear, and I braked too early, and I didn't go on the light... blah blah blah - I think you ran something like a high 12 (I will find the slip - 12.7 I think). Anyone who made all the mistakes you claim to would have run a 14. You know what? I sucked at drag racing when I started, but I stayed with it and practiced. When I ran you and schooled you, I never got on the BBS and criticized you for your string of excuses, and I never gave you a hard time at the event... I smiled and said you did well and better luck next time. Now you are even BSing about the times I run! Now you're only a tenth off my times, huh? I'm amazed how fast people get after a little time to think up their version of events. We only lined up once, and on that run, I left you way, way, waaay back. If you're going to compare your best ever run, put that next to my best ever. If you think you are even CLOSE to me in drag racing, AutoX'ing, road course racing, or whatever, then get your a$$ out on the track and stop spectating. I don't I think you ever went to F1 and I know you never went to either of the dyno days I set up. You know what I think is lame? I think it's lame to criticize someone else who actually gets out there are RUNS in events rather than sits back and calls out other folks who are out there DOING it.

I was discussing tires with the guys at the Panoz school down here in Atlanta... I can't *believe* anyone would think tires don't get stale and stick much less over time. It's a very widely understood concept that tires age and stick much less. Don't take my word for it - call Michelin and ask them.

As for the Vette guys, I don't think you are an appropriate person to criticize them. Guess what - it was THEIR event! We were guests. There is certainly a Vette/Viper rivalry around here, and most of those guys are my friends. I couldn't care less what most of them think that are not my friends, and the ones that are I take it all in stride - I rib them about stuff too. Maybe the Vette guys wouldn't think we were such a bunch of wimps if more of us actually RAN our cars. There were some classic Vettes out there, including a numbers-matching big-block... it takes a REAL enthusiast to run that kind of car in an AutoX - he had more business watching from the sidelines than you.

That "lame excuse" comment rubs me the wrong way. Ken is a good friend of mine and we are planning to run one lap this year. I invited the Viper guys and you're gonna show up to my friends event that you didn't even participate in despite repeated offers, and toss insults MY way? Un-frickin-believable!


EDIT: Tony, I am not including you when I talk about the "spectators"... first of all because I don't see you offering critique of me after the fact, and second because you were there, taking pics, socializing, having a good time, and I know you appreciate different aspects of the car, and you take the time to go to the events and participate in the ones that interest you.


EDIT2: Don, lest you think you hit a soft spot about my crappy AutoX performance, that's not the issue. What *IS* the issue to me is that first of all, I never heard any sort of critique at the event. If you have some sort of comments on my "excuses", then OUT WITH IT. Don't sugercoat it by preceeding it with how nice a guy I am, and how I know drag racing, etc... just say whats on your mind. And second, what bothers me is this... guess who was taking the MOST heat that day? I can assure you it wasn't me. Maybe when I blew both my runs in the first turn it was me, but since then, it's been the "poser" in the yellow RT who always shows but never goes. And I defended your posalicious ways and tried to get the guys to lay off. Perhaps they are more intuitive than I thought.

 

[robiferretti]