Standalone engine management

[DChan415]

I'd like to get an idea of how many people are running standalone engine management computers, which ones they're using, and their opinions on using it with the Viper. Anyone?

 

[FrankBarba]

If your going to go stand alone emgine mgmt system. Motec is where it is at. Contact SVSI they have the most R&D on this when it comes to vipers.

 

[Daniel Cragin/DC Performance Inc]

We are currently working with a local company on a stand
alone system. It will be completed in the next 2 weeks and we will be testing it on one of our cars.

 

[BYT U L8R]

West Coast Viper is also in the final stages of a stand alone system...Next month, I believe.

 

[Torquemonster]

All the top tuners - especially the boost tuners - use programmable computers - ask them and get a profile on the pros and cons of each. Just make sure you buy from them when you choose as a thank you for their help.

re Motec - definitely the best - definitely the most expensive.

BTW - I'm working with a contact at present re a possible stand alone knock sensor that could be used by Viper owners as most tuners do not have them. If anything comes of it I'll post.

 

[TomMiriViper]

All the top tuners - especially the boost tuners - use programmable computers - ask them and get a profile on the pros and cons of each. Just make sure you buy from them when you choose as a thank you for their help.

re Motec - definitely the best - definitely the most expensive.

BTW - I'm working with a contact at present re a possible stand alone knock sensor that could be used by Viper owners as most tuners do not have them. If anything comes of it I'll post.

DLM sometimes uses Motec and other parts. Not sure on the computer they use for most applications though? Doug can tell you more about it then I can.
Tom

 

[Olivier Caza]

I wonder if AEM makes the EMS for the Viper? I know it works VERY well with the Supra guys!

 

[Russ M]

I am very sure they do not yet.......

 

[DChan415]

I've spoken to AEM and though they are not coming out with an EMS for the Viper, they told me someone is working on adapting the EMS to work with the Viper. Dan? =)

I'd love a Motec... but It costs 3 times as much as other stand alones.

If a plug and play EMS shows up sometime in the near future. I'm there.

Otherwise, I'm probably going to try out Electromotive's Tec 3. I've used it with some turbo Lexus's and liked it.

 

[BYT U L8R]

AEM EMS is what west coast viper is working on...

 

[Russ M]

AEM is coming out with an EMS for the Viper. It just that they don't feel Vipers should be at the top of their priority list. I have tried on many occasions to convince the powers that be over there that Viper AEM units will be their best seller hands down, but they don't agree.

They are very close to a finished product but that was true over a year ago also. West coast vipers has nothing to do with the AEM unit, at most they could be waiting for a unit.

When they finally begin testing the unit I will fill you guys in on the results, until then there is nothing new.

 

[BYT U L8R]

I really do think that testing begins next month. From what I understand WCV is getting the first units and AEM is going to be helping with the fine tuning after WCV does the first go-rounds.

Do you know of someone else that is getting a unit, Russ? Just curious...

 

[Russ M]

Like I said when testing starts I will be the first to know. Since the only reason AEM is making a Viper unit is because since its beginings I insisted they make it 10 cylinder compatible, to make sure a Viper unit would be possible.

West coast Vipers did let AEM do data collection from their supercharged Viper on the dyno, which does help the unit become more of a reality.

I will keep you guys informed when there is a Viper driving around with an AEM box.

 

[SVS Turbo]

If your going to go stand alone emgine mgmt system. Motec is where it is at. Contact SVSI they have the most R&D on this when it comes to vipers.

SVS has tested for over 7 years utilizing the Motec EMS on Viper V-10's. We have focused the most on our Stryker Twin Turbo system. The information we have gathered from testing landspeed brings knowledge to all aspects of forced induction systems that we will build, including superchargers. Now that the sweet spot is more in control we will equate what we have learned into the 1/4 mile. I guess we will just have to wait and see how we do on the quick end.

With a limited budget and being a small tuning shop I think we have achieved good results and stood behind everything that we have built. We don’t gauge our business by the amount of systems we have created and sold, but by the level of control that we have over those systems.

Motec was the EMS that ran the GTSR engines that dominated in the racing world. The new Comp Coupe is also outfitted with Motec. The new SRT-4 engine in the Mopar backed Neon built by Darryl Cox is controlled by Motec. Precision tuning and controlling parameters that are not controllable by piggyback systems is how consistency and reliability are achieved in racing. Believe me I'm not saying Motec is for everything, but in forced induction V-10's it offers quite the advantage over piggyback systems. Much greater flexability and precision and options growth.

You must be registered for see images

Motec is expensive. Right now there is nothing available or proven that you can compare prices with for EMS on V-10 Vipers. It has been that way for more than 7 years. It is only a matter of time until someone will? or they won’t see the value in putting the R+D into it. SVS has spent the time and money in R+D to pursue precision forced induction Viper V-10 engine control. Mainly it has been a hobby, that turned into a business.

You can search through the posts and see that I tried to explain about Motec stand alone engine management almost 2 years ago. I guess that I came off arrogant and people said I made a fool of myself? Well I never professed that I was a PR guy, but I’m still trying.

Jr.
SVS

 

[Torquemonster]

Even if competition becomes available for the V10 Ron - it is most likely to remain a budget alternative that will be good value for those happy to meet the 80/20 rule - 80% of the benefit for 20% of the cost.

For those who want absolute precision and maxmimum options - it is hard to foresee anyone matching the years of Motec in R & D in professional racing - for a stand alone infinitely adjustable system with more options for control than you can poke a stick at.

I don't see MOTEC getting knocked off it's pedastal for some time - but then what do I know about what's going on in research labs. Any of the big car manufacturers involved in serious racing efforts over the years could elect to produce infinitely variable versions of their racing ECU setups and optional hardware, sensors etc... but seeing as that is their precious intellectual property - I'm not sure I'd hold my breath!

There are people who have cracked factory codes and can make GM computers do anything in 3D - creating infinite possibilities - but they are not feasible because you have to ship your car to them to set up on the dyno as they'll not part with their intellectual property to allow you to do it.

 

[DChan415]

I have no doubts that Motec is the top dog in engine management. However, to accomplish what I need to do, its price is just excessive.

All I want is to tune my fuel and ignition maps to run under boost, and be flexible enough to handle future upgrades. And more boost =)

I'd love to see the AEM computer released for sale, but the reality is that they'll probably sell more Supra/RX7/Honda computers than there are Vipers in existence on the planet.

I'll wait a few more weeks and hope for AEM to come through.

Hey SVS... can you email me regarding the costs of the Motec system?

 

[Russ M]

Motec is a fabulous Engine management unit, and I have used many in the past on numerous race cars. That being said, the AEM unit will do absolutly everything that the Motec unit can, and it is 1/3 the price.

The big advantage that the AEM unit has is installation, Motec requires complete wirring while the AEM unit just plugs right in.

The AEM unit will come to be reality, but it will NOT be in the next few weeks. Your only legitamate option at this point is a Motec unit. Even if they put one on my car tommorow and everything works as planned the final manufacturing will take at least 3 months to finish. And at this point we have no such set date to be testing anything.

 

[BYT U L8R]

I would like to know where you get your info about AEM. Robert the Manager over at AEM along with Jonathan (the lead tech) will be supplying West Coast Viper with a unit in middle to late October. PERIOD A full replacement to the factory PCM. Full timing control, band sensors even a knock sensor can be used with the unit...1800 bucks.

 

[WESTCOAST JASON]

Correct Jamie. The first unit released with be in late October and will be a Gen2 (year to be announced) PnP unit. Each year is slightly different and it has not been solidified on which will be first. The EMS will DIRECTLY replace the factory PCM (both physically and the wiring) and with the optional UEGO wide bands installed will even create its own base map. This project has been on-going and regardless of what the rumors are, the FACTS are that AEM is making it. I consult with AEM regularly on this issue and as sure is the sun will come up tommorow, this unit will be released. Want to get ready for it? Download the windows software at AEMPOWER.COM and get familiar with it. This unit will be less expensive and much better than the Motec unit it is hunting down!

westcoastviper.com

 

[Big Medicine]

So, what is expensive? Motec cost? Which system? I like this.

 

[Russ M]

I would like to know where you get your info about AEM. Robert the Manager over at AEM along with Jonathan (the lead tech) will be supplying West Coast Viper with a unit in middle to late October. PERIOD A full replacement to the factory PCM. Full timing control, band sensors even a knock sensor can be used with the unit...1800 bucks.

I get it straight from the top if you know what I mean.

And if they want $1800.00 for it, dont even bother. I will have suppliers for you at much more reasonable price.

 

[Miles B]

Apparently there are several Vipers running Autronic SM2s. Their lower model, the SMC, would probably do the same job for street drivers - the SM2 has all of the extra racing features like launch control, traction control and MoTeC dash compatibility. The SMC is priced quite low.. about one third of the MoTeC M800. There are many Autronic dealers in the USA, and I believe they are even putting on some lectures.

The AEM does not have all of the features of the MoTeC, but it probably has all of the ones you could conceivably need.

 

[SVS Turbo]

Over the years we have seen how the price of Motec has swayed customers interest from controlling their forced induction systems. We have also researched another EMS. Bigger company, more resources and definitely cheaper than all the above. Time frame? ........still waiting. A cheaper PnP for all vehicles is around the corner!

SVS

 

[Miles B]

A bigger company than Motec? Who is it.. Apex'i or something?

 

[Dyno Dave]

The production JTEC is completely programmable (unfortunately, not by the general public).

 

[Maverick The Electrician]

AEM advertised the viper ems 2 years ago and have not produced crap. With numerous phone calls we gave up. All the other AEM systems that were released we're way too early, pissed many customers and tuners off. I heard that the problems were finally corrected, but if interested in a viper system, you might want to wait for the long list of bugs to get worked out.

 

[DChan415]

Well it looks like theres plenty of interest in stand alones for the Viper. Maybe you guys should tell AEM about it. I guess I can run low boost until late October.

 

[Russ M]

Have been telling them for years.

The problems experienced with the AEM unit have mostly been due to tunner lack of knowledge, hence the creation of their tunning classes.

 

[Sean Roe]

Here's a couple of the tuning pages from our VEC2.
It has full fuel control as well as timing advance and retard maps with programmable outputs for relays or injectors (PWM). We have setting preferences for normally aspirated and forced induction.
We're sending out letters and releasing the software next week (please don't ask for it until I finish the manual this weekend )
There are already 103 of them on cars now...

You must be registered for see images

Regards,
Sean

 

[SVS Turbo]

Here's a couple of the tuning pages from our VEC2.
It has full fuel control as well as timing advance and retard maps with programmable outputs for relays or injectors (PWM). We have setting preferences for normally aspirated and forced induction.
We're sending out letters and releasing the software next week (please don't ask for it until I finish the manual this weekend )
There are already 103 of them on cars now...

Regards,
Sean

Is this a stand alone engine management system or piggyback system?

SVS