Chrysler states I do not own my car!!

[redtanrt10]

Harley, the reason they didn't include Delray MB is that they don't beleive they knowingly were involved in the fraud. I've seen some crazy frauds before, it's possible that; original owner knows the towing company and he/she works a deal with the towing company and the 2nd purchaser. 2nd owner say he bought at auction, sounds like a tow company private auction, how legit is that? I could be wrong but wouldn't be surprised if all 3 were in it together. You get served cause you've got the car. I'd bet if you had sold it a month ago, they wouldn't have served you they would have served the most current owner. Again, good luck, get an attorney. Probably will take months to resolve but I think you'll be OK in the end. Keep us all posted.

 

[AFL in NJ]

If I was you I'd have my attorney immediately file a countersuit for mental anguish and for preparation time (at whatever rate you make per hour) to gather the documents to support your countersuit. Likely once CFC gets the countersuit notification they'll move to drop you from the suit and name the 1st owner and towing company. They had to sue everyone initially because you are the only one with a clear title asset. If there was fraud obtaining a clear title for the 2nd owner, it would be his liability and his butt who'd get prosecuted.(If the local prosecutor even bothers to file charges)

The Mercedes dealership and yourselves have no liability because you had clear titling processes that were followed and done above board.

Your countersuit may fall under the "nuisance" category to the judge, but CFC would have to answer to your attorney if this ever got that far and there's a chance you'd get some small or token compensation.

Regards,
Aaron

 

[Flexx91]

If this falls under "receiving stolen goods" you might not win this battle. I lost a similar battle with products that I had purchased through my retail store. (wasn't a car) Good luck, this didn't work out favorably for me.

B.S. The car was legally obtained as evidenced by the clear title (so they say) and the title was legally conveyed to you as the owner. Therefore, the car cannot be legally repossessed from you as long as all of your documentation (Bill of Sale, etc.) is in order. Your issue lies with whomever you brought the car from since the "contract" (legal and binding) is between you and that entity. Dealers cannot legally sell vehicles with suspect titles (just like homes cannot be legally purchased with title issues). If they did, then they'll have to eat it along with your legal fees. The reason they put these laws in place is to protect the consumer (which you paid for in your title fees).

 

[kcobean]

I had to smile that you think it's only safe and smart to buy new, when I looked at your signature and see you have a 2006 coupe for sale. Probably have to find some dummy to buy it who doesn't feel the same way.

Good catch....can't use your sig as a classified ad here, so I have removed that.

 

[Austin]

You know, you guys are unreal. I'm far from rich, I just work hard, save, and pay cash. I work 14 - 18 hours a day and have very few if any days off. I haven't had a real vacation in over 10 years. I buy new cars because I don't want to have to deal with used any more. I keep my cars a long time generally.

"Baller" really ? REALLY ? bite me d00d! work hard, stay out of debt and you too can buy new even in this economy. If not, don't whine and call me names, get a real job, more education, whatever. That's the great part about this country.

--FQB

Wow. Someone is a little bent, eh? Just so you know, him calling you a "baller" is not an insult. Get over it. You sound like a whiny baby.



Harley, good luck with this situation. Sounds like a crappy deal, but I hope all works out for you.

 

[plumcrazy]

You know, you guys are unreal. I'm far from rich, I just work hard, save, and pay cash. I work 14 - 18 hours a day and have very few if any days off. I haven't had a real vacation in over 10 years. I buy new cars because I don't want to have to deal with used any more. I keep my cars a long time generally.

"Baller" really ? REALLY ? bite me d00d! work hard, stay out of debt and you too can buy new even in this economy. If not, don't whine and call me names, get a real job, more education, whatever. That's the great part about this country.

--FQB

not all of us LIKE or WANT the newest version of the viper and actually prefer the older gen. some here dont have much or any debt. its not always about money. the viper is not THAT much money, its within reach of most of us here.....relax francis

 

[plumcrazy]

and where is Mr Pantax when we need him...

 

[chiefchad]

I'm in agreement with Flexx91's take on this, however, I am also in agreement with some others on here who have suggested you "hide" the car for now. Chrysler Financial is a big company with some hotshot lawyers and may just be able to re-posess this car with a bailiff and "work it out later". That would really **** if you woke up and the driveway was empty. I would have the car stored at an undisclosed location, under lock and key, and I wouldn't even drive it until this gets sorted out. If you get pulled over and anything is remotely wrong with the title on the police database - it will most likely get towed and impounded and you will be fighting for the next 2 years to get it back. Just my 2 cents.

B.S. The car was legally obtained as evidenced by the clear title (so they say) and the title was legally conveyed to you as the owner. Therefore, the car cannot be legally repossessed from you as long as all of your documentation (Bill of Sale, etc.) is in order. Your issue lies with whomever you brought the car from since the "contract" (legal and binding) is between you and that entity. Dealers cannot legally sell vehicles with suspect titles (just like homes cannot be legally purchased with title issues). If they did, then they'll have to eat it along with your legal fees. The reason they put these laws in place is to protect the consumer (which you paid for in your title fees).

 

[JonB]

I agree w/ Taxi and Ray...... Bill P, what would YOUR title-clerk have to do to screw this one up like the MB dealer and State of FL did?

-The process server could just have well have been a CFC Re-Po truck along with him! (Move the car)

--The involved Tow-company in FL may also want to become a Re-Po man (Move the car)

---Did we say MOVE the car? i would find a trusted friend or relative (say in Georgia or Alabama, NOT FL) and store the car there....In the meantime, make sure your comprehensive insurance has a LOW deductible!

----I wonder if you can get a restrining order vs CFC / GMAC/ALLY to stop further action

-----I bet if you 'run the vin" at a Dodge Dealer it wont show ANY Lein info.... Any more than CarCraps fax service did. TRY IT! Was that fax a guaranteed one? They claim so!

GOOD LUCK.....

 

[JonB]

and where is Mr Pantax when we need him...

So he can advise if the potential loss is tax-deductible!?

 

[georgethedog]

Another reason why I only buy and/or lease new factory ordered cars.

Good for you, but many of us cannot afford a new Viper and that is why there is a market for used ones...

Best of luck, Harley.

 

[plumcrazy]

hiding the car might actually be the thing to get you in trouble. just a thought.

 

[plumcrazy]

So he can advise if the potential loss is tax-deductible!?

nope, just a lawyer from florida id trust an opinion from.

 

[2 VENOMOUS]

Harley, I use Title And Lien company here in south Fl, I'll call tomorrow and see if I can get you some answers...I don't think you have much to worry about as you obtained a legal title, issues may lie with parties before you...I mean if you choose to part the car out and deem it worthless, would they hold you responsible for their loss?? I bet then they would look elsewhere.

 

[Ray W]

Probably wouldn't be a bad idea to keep a certified copy of the title with the car at all times. It's issue date will supercede prior titles and at would cause a police officer to view any other claim of ownership as suspect. Turning it into a civil matter instead of a criminal one.

 

[Herc]

You own the car outright, you have a clear title. If someone were to step on my property and try to
tale something I owned outright I might cut them in half or go burn down the towing company.
That's legal in Florida right?

Herc

 

[sun diego]

Contact Carfax and try and cash in on their guarantee. I believe it is only 5K, but it gets more lawyers working that you aren't paying.

 

[eucharistos]

situation stinks for sure

some good advice here as usual

pls let us know what happens

 

[Stealth]

We are on the same page. Neither the General Counsel at my firm, nor my attorney can figure out why Mercedes of Delray was not listed as a defendant since they sold the car. Their assumption is that it is a matter of politics.

My attorney is preparing my Answer now. Updates to follow.

Thank you all very much for your imput.

Ask your attorneys to check into the concept of a "Bona Fide Good Faith Purchaser for value without knowledge" of any previous sale/title issues. The facts state you knew nothing about a title problem. You reasonably relied on Mercedes to give you good title. You paid a reasonable (non-nominal) price for the car--who would do this if they knew their was a title problem?

Chrysler's beef should be with purchaser 1, purchaser 2, the towing company and/or your seller, the Mercedes dealership.

It may be possible to recover your legal fees based on the terms of your purchase contract and possibly a statute of the "choice of law" state.

Your purchase contract with Mercedes should specify that they must deliver clear title to the vehicle. If they did not--for whatever reason--then this is a breach of contract and you may seek damages and other remedies.

If you paid a deeply discounted price for the car based on knowledge that the car may have title problems, then you may have issues... .

Good luck!

 

[J&R3xV10]

It seems to me that the first thing I would do is file a lawsuit against the dealership that sold you the car. After moving the car of course! It is for unforeseen BS like this that I often have liens put on my cars for the full value of the car so that in the event someone tries to take my cars in a lawsuit they must first pay the lien amount, which provides a great deterrent.

As for only buying new cars I would have to agree for me its the only way to go. I am far from rich but my cars come as a priority to me and I make sacrifices in other ways to achieve my goals. Not to say that anyone else is wrong or foolish to buy used, but this does provide a good example as to why it can be worth it when it is an option. Just sayin'

 

[Fatboy 18]

Contact Carfax and try and cash in on their guarantee. I believe it is only 5K, but it gets more lawyers working that you aren't paying.

Thats what I was thinking too, Carfax offer a Buy back guarantee, did you take this out?

 

[Joseph Houss]

Sounds VERY logical. Seems that the MB dealership sold you a "stolen" car:

It seems fairly clear to me that Harley561 has no liability here....he paid the MB dealership, if he doesn't own the car, then the MB dealership owes him what he paid them.

Of course, this would make to much common sense to actually be true.

 

[EllowViper]

Since we are such a small community, I have to think the 1st and/or 2nd owner must be known by someone or have frequented this site in the past. Come on all you Columbo's out there...who were the previous owners??

 

[STUGOTS]

I agree with Joseph and J&R there is NO WAY IN HELL the MB dealer is just, stepping aside and allowing you to deal with this, THEY sold you that car with a clean title, this is their mistake and as a licensed dealership they screwed up.

 

[PatentLaw]

So much bad advice on this thread it is laughable. Warning to the thread poster. Don't believe everything you read here. In fact, this thread is quite dangerous. Sure hope you know what you are doing.

Another word of advice. Work with your hired attorney and don't go for the "free" legal advice. Many of us make our money through "advice". It is how we feed our families. If I asked for a free "paving" job for the front of my house, or whatever you do for a living, because I needed it, I am sure that I would never get it. Good work is never free. Ever wonder why you don't get many of the lawyers here to respond to the thread? Think about it. Also, a majority of the lawyers on this website have no freaking clue as to what to do in your case, and just won't respond because their "image" would be damaged or they don't want to be pinned down for wrong advice.

There is your free legal advice.......Not trying to be nasty, just realisitic.

I won't let you go away empty handed and redfaced. Although I am not an attorney in your state, in my opinion, your attorney seems to be on to something. I will let you read between those lines. Good luck.

I will give you another nugget. In many jurisdictions, it is tough to get your legal fees picked up by the other side. You can ask, but the court sees it in every paper coming across their desk. Your retainer, hopefully, has a maximum on it for legal costs.

 

[chiefchad]

]WARNING; the following suggestion is absolutely atrocious advice that was free and does not come from a highly paid legally trained advisor. This advice may get you into trouble with the authorities or Chrysler Financial. Please do not use this advice if you are a by the book, fancy panted, straightlined, bran eating, outstanding member of your community. This advice may be hazardous to your spot free criminal record.....

If I have paid for the car and owe nobody nothing on this car, and I bought it from a reputable dealer with a clear title and in good faith - you can be rest assured this is MY car and nobody elses. I don't care what a fancy piece of legal paperwork served to me says. I would not let this car get "stolen" from me in the middle of the night by some people who are by all intents and purposes trying to take this car from me because they have manipulated some legislation into their favour. MY car would be stored and locked at an undisclosed location so that it could not be stolen from me until this gets resolved. This is what I would do if it were MY car. I'm not telling you what to do with YOUR car of course.....

 

[Flexx91]

]WARNING; the following suggestion is absolutely atrocious advice that was free and does not come from a highly paid legally trained advisor. This advice may get you into trouble with the authorities or Chrysler Financial. Please do not use this advice if you are a by the book, fancy panted, straightlined, bran eating, outstanding member of your community. This advice may be hazardous to your spot free criminal record.....

Man, you beat me to it.......I was getting ready to let 'ole fancy pants have one but I'd rather act "professionally" and keep my comments to myself. On the other hand, if that person feels as if he/she fits this shoe, I would be more than happy to continue the discussion via PM.

 

[2 VENOMOUS]

Harley, got some info for you....pm sent.

 

[Bobpantax]

Hi. Sorry to read about your problem. It is very interesting and would make an excellent question on a final exam in a Commercial Law class at law school.

You need to locate an attorney who is an expert on Florida Statutes Chapter 672 and 679 and the case law interpretting same, which, among other things, cover the rights of a bona fide purchaser for value and the rights of a perfected lien creditor.

Make sure you locate someone who is knowledgeable. The dealer and Chrysler Credit will have knowledgeable attorneys in this area and if you do not you will not have any credibility in dealing with them. Someone who is an expert in the area should be able to give you a pretty quick answer regarding your rights assuming you possess a complete and accurate description of what actually happened.

I wish I could give you the name of someone who is an expert on this subject but I do not know any. If you have a trusted long time attorney, perhaps he can help you locate someone.

Good luck!

 

[Garron]

Sounds VERY logical. Seems that the MB dealership sold you a "stolen" car:

Bingo !!!!!!!!