Chrysler states I do not own my car!!

[Harley561]

This is the most condensed version of the last three days that I can come up with:

I wake up Saturday morning, after owning my car for two months, to a process server at my door. He hands me a summons which lists Chrysler Financial Corp. as the Plaintiff and the Defendants as the first two owners of my car, a towing company and me.

Chrysler claims the first owner of the car was in default and that they tried to work with them for months. They claim the first owner owes $64K plus attorney fees.

During all this (circa 2008) the car was towed. The towing company claims they posted and auction in the paper and mailed CFC (Chrysler Financial) to give them notice after the car sat unclaimed for 45+ days. CFC claims they called the towing company and a rep said the car was returned to the owner.

Later, CFC learns the car was sold to the second owner at an auction that the towing company held. They also found that a new lien on the vehicle was recorded and a new title issued.

CFC contacted the second owner who confirmed he bought the car at an auction and verified the VIN#.

The second owner financed the car and traded it in to Mercedes of Delray Beach where I bought the car. Mercedes paid off the second owners lien and recorded my banks lien on the new title. I have since paid the car off and have a clear title.

One would assume they own a car since they have a clear title that is recorded with the Florida DMV. Well, CFC doesnt feel this way.

CFC is claimig Breach of Contract against the first owner, Unfair and Deceptive Trade Practice, Civil Theft, Fraud, Conversion and Unjust Enrichment against the towing company and Conspiracy against the Towning Co, CEO and 2nd owner.

They go on to say the 2nd owner obtained the title by fraud as a result of unlawful storage and towing lien sale conducted by the towing company. They end with stating that I have no legal right to the vehicle....nor did the 2nd owner.

The GM at MB of Delray told me on Saturday he would "do everything to make this right" they would "get in touch with CFC" and "not to worry". On Monday the story changed and he stated they did what they are suppossed to do and this is between me and the other parties. Their searches showed no liens other than the one they paid off on the trade...i.e. good luck to you.

The car never left Palm Beach county so I dont understand why this is first happening now after I own the car and why it wasnt stopped when CFC learned of the second owner.

As I wait for my attorney to call me back, this is where things stand. I may have left out a detail or two but you get the idea.

Thoughts? Opinions? Free legal advice?

 

[FLATOUT]

Thoughts? Cars with stories are cars with stories.

Best of luck to you though if you knew nothing about the prior history.

 

[Harley561]

I had the car inspected, I obtained the carfax on my own and was given a title. The state was not aware of any of these issues otherwise they would have stopped the title from being issued. Not sure what more I could have done. I bought the car from a respected MB dealer.

 

[ZYellow01RT]

Sounds like you should be the one suing Delray.

 

[ferraritoviper]

Another reason why I only buy and/or lease new factory ordered cars.

 

[ohiotj]

You had better hide that viper until it is all resolved.

 

[fqberful]

Another reason why I only buy and/or lease new factory ordered cars.

+1,000,000 ... There's a number of other benefits to that as well. It's well worth any depreciation hit, and with a well negotiated deal the hit need not be all that big.

--FQB

 

[kcobean]

I have absolutely no advice or knowledge in this arena, I'm just subscribing because I'm curious to know how this turns out. The pessimist in me says it won't end well (I have no faith in the courts if that's where this goes.). The optimist in me says that hopefully, CFC ends up getting their money from the towing company, which is who actually had any part in any wrongdoing. They lied to Chrysler about returning the car to the owner when in fact they had probably already sold the car at auction.

Hope it ends favorably for you. Please keep us posted.

 

[2snakes4us]

You had better hide that viper until it is all resolved.

I agree, keep it locked up!

 

[ZYellow01RT]

Just keep track of any time away from work (i.e., "lost wages", etc.), so that you try to recoup them in any lawsuit against the party that you decide to sue (if that's the avenue that you choose). Which is what I would do. My .02 (inflation-adjusted).

 

[Mopar Steve]

If this falls under "receiving stolen goods" you might not win this battle. I lost a similar battle with products that I had purchased through my retail store. (wasn't a car) Good luck, this didn't work out favorably for me.

 

[Bill Pemberton Woodhouse]

Curious situation and it will be interesting to see what the attorneys on the Forum say. Since you have a title from the State, it may be a case of no fault to you the consumer, and CFC may have to go after the towing company for compensation. In some States, if the title is clear, it is to the benefit of the consumer, and in this case since the lien was paid off and duly noted, it could be interesting to see whom CFC truly goes after ---- hopefully your attorney lets you know that their case will be against the company alledgely committing the fraud, the towing company.

 

[Next Phase]

Damn, that is messed up... I agree. I would move the car to a friend's house until it gets all cleared up.

The fact that you paid the car off and now they say it isn't yours is b.s.

Good luck!

 

[kcobean]

Curious situation and it will be interesting to see what the attorneys on the Forum say. Since you have a title from the State, it may be a case of no fault to you the consumer, and CFC may have to go after the towing company for compensation. In some States, if the title is clear, it is to the benefit of the consumer, and in this case since the lien was paid off and duly noted, it could be interesting to see whom CFC truly goes after ---- hopefully your attorney lets you know that their case will be against the company alledgely committing the fraud, the towing company.

And in this regard, the only entity that wrongfully profited from the course of events was the towing company. They sold a car that effectively belonged to someone else and then lied about the disposition of the car by stating it had been returned to the owner. If they get hauled in to court, they will have to manufacture false documents to try and substantiate this lie. I sincerely hope CFC goes after the towing company even IF the law allows them to go after the consumer. That would be the right thing to do.

 

[Steve-Indy]

Sorry to hear about this...and, in my opinion, it continues to perpetuate the rumors filtering out-of-state that buying used cars in Florida for some reason still seems to be more risky than average.

Though it will likely NOT help Harley561, I would remind others that I NEVER pass up the opportunity to tell prospective Viper buyers to "run the VIN at a Dodge dealership BEFORE you go very far"...for MORE THAN ONE REASON !!!

Agree with legal help ASAP...though I would go for paid, first class advice from an experienced attorney since these are complex cases indeed.

Hopefully, Harley561 will come out OK with this good looking Viper !!!

 

[Dom426h]

Another reason why I only buy and/or lease new factory ordered cars.

+1,000,000 ... There's a number of other benefits to that as well. It's well worth any depreciation hit, and with a well negotiated deal the hit need not be all that big.

Spoken like true Ballers

But what if your not some baller just looking for the next best 2010,2011,2012,ect... There are many of us car guys that are very passionate about some older vehicles ranging from something like a Jaguar Etype to a FordGT for example.

A man with a 2006 FordGT, 1973 Jaguar E-Type, and a Gen1 Viper has much more character in his garage and carguy passion in his heart than a rich guy who simply likes to have nice things with his 2010 AudiR8, 2010 Benze, and 2010 Lambo sitting in his garage.

 

[redtanrt10]

I've been in the auto finance business for 30 years (2 tours w/CFC for 12 years) and I never heard of a situation like this. For starters you unfortunately need to hire an attorney. He may advise you to sue the MB dealer or at minimum have the MB dealer pay your defense in the lawsuit. The MB dealer has a problem in this situation, he is liable to you for any costs and any financial damages you incur. The courts are usually very sympathic to consumers who dealt in good faith. Hopefully the towing company will either win their case or be found liable. Good news is that you have the title in your name and possession of the car. My prediction is in the end you'll still have your viper, your attorney fee's paid and a great story to tell. Call an attorney now and tell the dealer "good luck" isn't good enough. Best wishes, Mike

 

[TAXIMAN1]

Sorry to hear about this...and, in my opinion, it continues to perpetuate the rumors filtering out-of-state that buying used cars in Florida for some reason still seems to be more risky than average.

Though it will likely NOT help Harley561, I would remind others that I NEVER pass up the opportunity to tell prospective Viper buyers to "run the VIN at a Dodge dealership BEFORE you go very far"...for MORE THAN ONE REASON !!!

Agree with legal help ASAP...though I would go for paid, first class advice from an experienced attorney since these are complex cases indeed.

Hopefully, Harley561 will come out OK with this good looking Viper !!!

All I can add to this is. I have lived in 2 states in my lifetime, and titled many cars in both of them. FL is WAYYYY more difficult to get title work done, than NJ.

You need a notary stating it is the ACTUAL VIN, AND a DMV officer has to actually see the car and VIN, in person.. And if you are taking a note. You never even see the title... They keep it, and electronically record the lein. AND..... all this can be found online by the owners name, via a county records search.. NJ, none of the above.. Just write your name on the back of the old title, and they give you a new title right there.

There may have been a hole in the system years back. But believe me, They have overcorrected it, if anything.

Harley, sent you a PM. I can help.

 

[past ohio]

Seems that something like this happened about 5 or 6 years ago in Ohio, a guy bought a collector's type Trans Am, not sure if smokey type or whatever, for years because there wasn't a good VIN used and titles kept getting issued on an incorrect VIN, finally a smart highway patrolman was doing a vehicle check and removed the heater box and there was the original VIN and because it was reported stolen, the car immediately got returned to the original owner, the other people that put money in it over the years were S>O>L>, and up to them to get the lawyers to try and sort out.....over the years I also recall something like this happening on an older Mustang (64 or so) and because it was reported stolen, the car gets returned to the original owner....all the others that were carrying titles with a bad VIN number were S>O>L>....anyone else recall some of these cases ???

 

[99 R/T 10]

You had better hide that viper until it is all resolved.

^^^this is good advice^^^^^

Also, get a lawyer now!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[PDCjonny]

Spoken like true Ballers

But what if your not some baller just looking for the next best 2010,2011,2012,ect... There are many of us car guys that are very passionate about some older vehicles ranging from something like a Jaguar Etype to a FordGT for example.

A man with a 2006 FordGT, 1973 Jaguar E-Type, and a Gen1 Viper has much more character in his garage and carguy passion in his heart than a rich guy who simply likes to have nice things with his 2010 AudiR8, 2010 Benze, and 2010 Lambo sitting in his garage.

Spot on.
Makes me hate New Yorkers and I am one.

 

[viper067]

It seems fairly clear to me that Harley561 has no liability here....he paid the MB dealership, if he doesn't own the car, then the MB dealership owes him what he paid them.

Of course, this would make to much common sense to actually be true.

 

[mattdillon]

I still can't get over you paid it off in 2 months.Good Luck

 

[LifeIsGood]

Spoken like true Ballers

But what if your not some baller just looking for the next best 2010,2011,2012,ect... There are many of us car guys that are very passionate about some older vehicles ranging from something like a Jaguar Etype to a FordGT for example.

A man with a 2006 FordGT, 1973 Jaguar E-Type, and a Gen1 Viper has much more character in his garage and carguy passion in his heart than a rich guy who simply likes to have nice things with his 2010 AudiR8, 2010 Benze, and 2010 Lambo sitting in his garage.

I was thinking the same thing...I guess it's good to be ferraritoviper and fqberful...some of the rest of us must be losers that can't afford brand new everything.

 

[Harley561]

It seems fairly clear to me that Harley561 has no liability here....he paid the MB dealership, if he doesn't own the car, then the MB dealership owes him what he paid them.

Of course, this would make to much common sense to actually be true.

We are on the same page. Neither the General Counsel at my firm, nor my attorney can figure out why Mercedes of Delray was not listed as a defendant since they sold the car. Their assumption is that it is a matter of politics.

My attorney is preparing my Answer now. Updates to follow.

Thank you all very much for your imput.

 

[Camfab]

Wow, what a nightmare. Remember that thread last week where the guy rammed his SUV through the Ford dealership and everyone said he was crazy.

 

[TAXIMAN1]

We are on the same page. Neither the General Counsel at my firm, nor my attorney can figure out why Mercedes of Delray was not listed as a defendant since they sold the car. Their assumption is that it is a matter of politics.

My attorney is preparing my Answer now. Updates to follow.

Thank you all very much for your imput.

I sent you a PM to call me, but did not get a reply.. So, just to cut to the chase. This is an Insurance claim for MB of Delray, plain and fairly simple. (assuming everything happened the way you say it did, of course) A dealer must sell a car with a clear (lein free) title, or they eat it. It might take a little to get worked out. But you should be fine.

 

[Ray W]

I think that the dealer that sold it to you has a problem. You should wish "them" good luck. In the meantime keep the car somewhere safe for them till it is resolved.

 

[fqberful]

I was thinking the same thing...I guess it's good to be ferraritoviper and fqberful...some of the rest of us must be losers that can't afford brand new everything.

Spoken like true Ballers

But what if your not some baller just looking for the next best 2010,2011,2012,ect... There are many of us car guys that are very passionate about some older vehicles ranging from something like a Jaguar Etype to a FordGT for example.

A man with a 2006 FordGT, 1973 Jaguar E-Type, and a Gen1 Viper has much more character in his garage and carguy passion in his heart than a rich guy who simply likes to have nice things with his 2010 AudiR8, 2010 Benze, and 2010 Lambo sitting in his garage.

You know, you guys are unreal. I'm far from rich, I just work hard, save, and pay cash. I work 14 - 18 hours a day and have very few if any days off. I haven't had a real vacation in over 10 years. I buy new cars because I don't want to have to deal with used any more. I keep my cars a long time generally.

"Baller" really ? REALLY ? bite me d00d! work hard, stay out of debt and you too can buy new even in this economy. If not, don't whine and call me names, get a real job, more education, whatever. That's the great part about this country.

--FQB

 

[Smog Dog]

+1,000,000 ... There's a number of other benefits to that as well. It's well worth any depreciation hit, and with a well negotiated deal the hit need not be all that big.

--FQB

I had to smile that you think it's only safe and smart to buy new, when I looked at your signature and see you have a 2006 coupe for sale. Probably have to find some dummy to buy it who doesn't feel the same way.