Pennzoil Ultra Euro 5- 40

Dom426h

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 26, 2007
Posts
2,632
Reaction score
0
Location
DE
I would say that it is debatable what is "enough" ZDDP. High levels of ZDDP are particularly important for lubricating flat tappet lifter/camshafts. I'm pretty sure that the Viper has roller lifters (I haven't seen a V10 apart.) So, do we really need to be concerned about ZDDP ? .

Yes IMO. The flat tappet lifter/camshafts VS roller argument holds no weight to me. Just because a flat tappet lifter/camshaft can fail using oils without sufficient additives doesn’t mean they are the only type of engines that can benefit form the additives.

In a high stress track environment our vipers can be prone to oil starvation & bearing failures. If you run these 40weight oils that have higher levels of ZDDP then you are helping to preserve your bearings. This is very important to me. Even though an engine rebuild is inevitable in my future, i would definitely not like it to be premature.
 

99 R/T 10

Enthusiast
Joined
Jun 4, 2001
Posts
10,314
Reaction score
0
Location
Enterprise, AL USA
^^^^^^^^^^^^this^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I would rather have ZDDP than not. The 5w-40 diesel has the highest content of ZDDP if I am not mistaken.
 

Dom426h

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 26, 2007
Posts
2,632
Reaction score
0
Location
DE
The above oil is at least stated at Pennzoil home page the recomended oil for the 2009 and up Vipers..
is it also a good choice for a 2000 GTS ? would appreciate some input on engine oil and viscosity used by
the forum members

Rick, IMO the new Pennzoil is better for your motor than the OEM M1 10w30

Since everyone is chiming in with their favorite oil guess i'll add two more to the list no-one thusfar has mentiond

I run either of these in my 97:

Shell Rotella T6 5w40

You must be registered for see images


Motul 8100 5w40

You must be registered for see images
 
Last edited:

Ron

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 6, 2000
Posts
2,137
Reaction score
1
Location
Indianapolis
Like Dom, I also use Shell Rotella T6, 5W-40 diesel synthetic in all my cars, including the Viper. Had used Delvac 1, the Mobil 1 diesel equivalent but found the Shell oil to be available virtually everywhere, slightly less expensive and the same great oil test results (UOA) as when I used Mobil products.

Remember, the most knowledgeable oil guy on this board uses diesel non-synthetic oil and as I remember he's in the 100k+ club with his Viper, a New York state (winters!) daily driver .
 

Dom426h

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 26, 2007
Posts
2,632
Reaction score
0
Location
DE
Depends. 30 & 40 are each a number assigned to a range. Once an oil's viscosity gets high enough it gets bumped into the next range. So a 30 at the upper end of its range could be damn close to a 40 that is lower in its range.

The higher viscosity alone can give a motor more protection when running hard and hot(like trackdays).
The lower viscosity can possibly make a couple more hp and get slightly better fuel mileage.
These differances are pretty minimal though. Its not like you'd actually notice a measurable diff in MPG.
Car manufactures and the epa measure in fine detail as every tenth is countd for cafe regulations. This one of the reasons alot of newer regular/economy vehicles run 20wt oil.

One differences which others have commented on is that 40's are alowed to have higher zddp levels. 20&30's are not since our government considers them economy oils for the masses and regulates them as such.
 

Roysviper

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 10, 2007
Posts
929
Reaction score
0
Location
Milton,FL
OF COURSE they will say that...they want to sell oil..........I have NEVER used anything other then MOBIL 1 in all my Vipers........look at the hotrod magazines with the picture of a GTS red Viper in the VALVOLINE oil commercials for yrs now saying it is for Vipers....NOT!!!!!!

STAY with Mobil 1 as is recommended for your Viper in your manual and on your oil cap......cant go wrong that way.....


The above oil is at least stated at Pennzoil home page the recomended oil for the 2009 and up Vipers..
is it also a good choice for a 2000 GTS ? would appreciate some input on engine oil and viscosity used by
the forum members
 

Ron

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 6, 2000
Posts
2,137
Reaction score
1
Location
Indianapolis
Just to throw another variable into the mix (fuel on the fire), is the Mobil One 10w-30 formula from 1992 the same as the Mobil One formula today? No. Was Mobil One the recommended and factory fill oil because it was the best available at the time? Probably. Was it also because it was a part of marketing deal with Mobil? Absolutely. Doesn't make it bad but is part of the overall equation in the "factory recommended oil" game. Think of the amount of oil used over the lifetime of a car and how often the recommended oil is the oil an owner uses throughout, then add the value of the recommendation in advertising. A pretty valuable place to be if you're an oil manufacturer.

It's $22.00 to get a used oil analysis from Blackstone Labs. If you're curious, run the factory recommended oil and test. Run your new oil flavor of the day and test. Compare. Numbers don't lie.
 
Last edited:

Allan

Enthusiast
Joined
Mar 7, 2009
Posts
2,546
Reaction score
0
Location
La Junta Colorado 81050
maybe we should all just use the oil that comes in the most attractive bottle, or the one with the coolest commercial. .........I'm gonna do a little in-depth research to see what Danika Patrick uses in her personal cars, then that's what I will use. ;)
 

Steve-Indy

VCA Venom Member
Venom Member
Joined
Oct 2, 2000
Posts
8,522
Reaction score
164
Location
Zionsville,IN. USA
There is so much more to taking PROPER care of a Viper (or any other car for that matter) than just the engine oil. I constantly encounter Vipers that are 8, 10, 15, 18 years old with same power steering fluid that was installed at the factory, out of date coolant (up to 10 years old!!), clutch fluid that has NEVER been changed, nasty looking brake fluid, etc. Admittedly these Vipers had low or relatively low mileage/usage. There is more to Viper-life than just motor oil !! :)
 
OP
OP
R

Rickman6

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 16, 2008
Posts
132
Reaction score
0
Location
Sweden
Wow... didn't quite expect this reaction when I asked /started this thread... I love the Viper and the forum - people that comes with it -are on this site...
never a dull moment and no question that we are all strong individuals with tons of experience and opinions...
However, despite 2 pages of info ...I'm still in the dark if my original question is answered....I guess as I track my car next to 100 %
and exchange the engine oil every second track event it doesn't really matter what brand oil I use...as long as the viscosity,amount,temperature and pressure is sufficient I should be pretty safe...I've rebuilt the sump with the trapdoors etc. and all parameter as well as pressure has never been a problem ...so far...
thank you dear Viper friends and keep up the spirit of sharing info etc...
 

Dom426h

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 26, 2007
Posts
2,632
Reaction score
0
Location
DE
You must be registered for see images


It says SRT right on the bottle. Nice:)
 

Attachments

  • pz-ultra-0w-40.jpg
    pz-ultra-0w-40.jpg
    46 KB · Views: 7
Last edited:

jcaspar1

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 3, 2000
Posts
1,126
Reaction score
0
Location
Sacramento, CA
Ultra SRT looks like the one, not Ultra Euro. Besides, our cars are much too good to use stuff designed for Euros...
 

TexasViper35

Enthusiast
Joined
Jan 26, 2013
Posts
231
Reaction score
31
Such an old thread, but today it is getting hard to find the standard Mobil 1 10w30. Walmart stopped offering it, they now only sell the High Mileage and Extended Mileage versions. I assume the high mileage version is essentially the same base oil with increased additives. Mobil says it’s for high mileage cars that were using conventional oil, so certainly this version would clean up those engines, but I’m unsure how it would work in a car that has run full synthetic M1 its entire life.

Does anyone have any info on the M1 High Mileage version being used in a Viper, car or truck? Or other performance car? Mine is a Gen III for reference.
 
Last edited:

Steve M

Enthusiast
Joined
Dec 29, 2011
Posts
1,069
Reaction score
194
Location
Dayton, OH
Not directly applicable, but below is a screen capture from a Facebook post by Dick Winkles about Viper engine oil recommendations. Although what he wrote was more for the Gen 4/5 crowd that used 0w40 from the factory, I'd say his advice should still apply, especially the last part for you:

You must be registered for see images attach

You must be registered for see images attach

You must be registered for see images attach
 

Steve M

Enthusiast
Joined
Dec 29, 2011
Posts
1,069
Reaction score
194
Location
Dayton, OH
Transcribed from the screen caps above in case the links are broken or the image hosting site goes away (emphasis added is mine):

From Dick Winkles:

Ok, here’s my “opinion” based on my 22+ years of engine testing and development with Chrysler and the Viper V-10. I’m no chemical PhD but I was fortunate enough to work with several through the years who were with Chrysler, ExxonMobil, Shell and Lubrizol. At Chrysler we tested quite a variety of oils from different suppliers over the years running just basic performance tests and various wear and durability test. This subject could easily take up an entire chapter in the History Book of Viper (if any such thing were to actually exist!) so I’ll cut to the chase and tell you what I run in my own Viper and why. Remember, my opinion based on my experiences over the years of engine testing and development. First a few general comments/observations.

1) Stick with the major manufacturers/suppliers. I know company XYZ claims their oil makes gobs more power and reduces friction and wear better than anything else ever. Show me the data – and I’m not talking about a few runs comparing oils on a chassis Dyno! You simply cannot find real results running on a Superflow or Dynojet. You must test in a precisely controlled and very repeatable environment – like the $1M test cells the major manufacturers have, a big investment for “boutique” oil producers.

Sorry, apparently ran out of space after I had finished my speech!

So, to be brief, when we changed to the Pennzoil (which is made by Shell) from Mobil 1 it was a purchasing directive, not from engineering. We were part of DaimlerChrysler at that time and there were financial and political reasons for the switch. In addition, we could claim a fuel economy improvement with the new 0W-40 oil. We had our marching orders so we tested the new 0W-40 and compared the results to the 5W-40 we had been using and found negligible improvement in output, a very slight improvement in fuel consumption and increased wear on pistons, rings, cylinder bores and bearing surfaces. The Shell team was great to work with and some changes to the oils formulation and additive package were made based on our tests. However, the 0W-40 never provided as good of wear protection as the higher viscosity base oil blends be it Mobil 1 or Shell. Our testing was generally done in Warner conditions due to the nature of the car – who drives a Viper at -10F or even 30F for that matter and that’s probably where the zero based oils would shine. Vipers also tend to sit for extended periods more than “normal” everyday cars.

Therefore, I usually recommend the Mobil 1 “High Mileage” oils since their additive package includes higher amount of detergent to keep sludging under control and added seal conditioners to help prevent leaks due to dried out or shrunken seals and gaskets. The higher base weight of 10 will shear down less over time and provide a higher film strength and oil pressure. I really like the 10W-40 H.M. oil for those reasons. If you are a racer, the Mobil 1 15W-50 or the Pennzoil 5W-60 race oils are my picks. I think Shell also has a High Mileage product as well that I’m sure would also be an excellent choice.
 

Badsnek

Enthusiast
Joined
Jun 7, 2020
Posts
21
Reaction score
11
Location
Enterprise, Alabama
Transcribed from the screen caps above in case the links are broken or the image hosting site goes away (emphasis added is mine):

From Dick Winkles:

Ok, here’s my “opinion” based on my 22+ years of engine testing and development with Chrysler and the Viper V-10. I’m no chemical PhD but I was fortunate enough to work with several through the years who were with Chrysler, ExxonMobil, Shell and Lubrizol. At Chrysler we tested quite a variety of oils from different suppliers over the years running just basic performance tests and various wear and durability test. This subject could easily take up an entire chapter in the History Book of Viper (if any such thing were to actually exist!) so I’ll cut to the chase and tell you what I run in my own Viper and why. Remember, my opinion based on my experiences over the years of engine testing and development. First a few general comments/observations.

1) Stick with the major manufacturers/suppliers. I know company XYZ claims their oil makes gobs more power and reduces friction and wear better than anything else ever. Show me the data – and I’m not talking about a few runs comparing oils on a chassis Dyno! You simply cannot find real results running on a Superflow or Dynojet. You must test in a precisely controlled and very repeatable environment – like the $1M test cells the major manufacturers have, a big investment for “boutique” oil producers.

Sorry, apparently ran out of space after I had finished my speech!

So, to be brief, when we changed to the Pennzoil (which is made by Shell) from Mobil 1 it was a purchasing directive, not from engineering. We were part of DaimlerChrysler at that time and there were financial and political reasons for the switch. In addition, we could claim a fuel economy improvement with the new 0W-40 oil. We had our marching orders so we tested the new 0W-40 and compared the results to the 5W-40 we had been using and found negligible improvement in output, a very slight improvement in fuel consumption and increased wear on pistons, rings, cylinder bores and bearing surfaces. The Shell team was great to work with and some changes to the oils formulation and additive package were made based on our tests. However, the 0W-40 never provided as good of wear protection as the higher viscosity base oil blends be it Mobil 1 or Shell. Our testing was generally done in Warner conditions due to the nature of the car – who drives a Viper at -10F or even 30F for that matter and that’s probably where the zero based oils would shine. Vipers also tend to sit for extended periods more than “normal” everyday cars.

Therefore, I usually recommend the Mobil 1 “High Mileage” oils since their additive package includes higher amount of detergent to keep sludging under control and added seal conditioners to help prevent leaks due to dried out or shrunken seals and gaskets. The higher base weight of 10 will shear down less over time and provide a higher film strength and oil pressure. I really like the 10W-40 H.M. oil for those reasons. If you are a racer, the Mobil 1 15W-50 or the Pennzoil 5W-60 race oils are my picks. I think Shell also has a High Mileage product as well that I’m sure would also be an excellent choice.
This is exactly why I will never run 0W in any of my Vipers. I wish this was more common knowledge. Thank you for continuing to share this information.
 

InTheZoneAC

Enthusiast
Joined
Jun 24, 2016
Posts
46
Reaction score
6
Dude,....don't put that pennzoil crap in your Viper, not even in your hyundai. Stick with the Mobil-1.
I wouldn't say it's crap. Many tests would argue ultra is one of the best oils out there, maybe close to amsoil since that's regarded as the #1
 
Top